'The Substance', Editor, Jérôme Eltabet

0:09Jawad MirWelcome back, everyone, to another episode of Kingdom of Dreams Podcast, the Making of Stories. I'm your host Jawad Miar. Today my guest is Jerome Elabeth. He's a film editor. He worked on the most recent film that came out that premiered at Cannes and premiered at TIFF, and has taken, the awards by storm. It stars Demi Moore, it stars Dennis Quaid, and it's called The Substance. Jerome and I talked about the film, its style, its aesthetics, but obviously the editing side of things. But, you know, the film itself, which is very unique and kind of reminded me of the films from the '90s, '80s, and the '70s. If you guys would like to make a suggestion for a film, for a guest, or anything else that you wanna have covered, including a book, an author, anything from the creative standpoint, please leave it in the comment below. And without further ado, here is my conversation with Jerome Elabeth, the film editor of Substance. Good to have you, Jerome, today on the podcast, to discuss, the film that you worked on, The Substance.

1:11Jérôme EltabetYeah.

1:11Jawad MirI had the pleasure of watching Substance, two days ago. And I had heard about it. I had seen some very quick clips with Demi Moore's character looking in the mirror. I hadn't seen a trailer, which is, normally I do. So I d… I just knew it was something about, you know, like anti-aging and that's it.

1:32Jérôme EltabetYeah.

1:32Jawad MirAnd, I really, everything about the film was very well done. You know, specifically, obviously cinematography, production design, editing, sound design, music. But for me, what I loved and it hooked me on immediately was the opening shot. I mean, that was just, you could literally end the film right there at the end of that shot. And it just…

2:00Jérôme EltabetAt the end, you mean, which one?

2:02Jawad MirSorry?

2:03Jérôme EltabetWho, you mean,.. Okay. Yeah, let's go on. Let's just…

2:07Jawad MirI mean the, I mean the ha… I mean the hall of fame. Like, you know how…

2:12Jérôme EltabetOkay. The walk of fame. Yeah.

2:13Jawad MirYeah. Walk of fame, sorry, not hall of fame.

2:14Jérôme EltabetYeah.

2:14Jawad MirI don't know why I said that.

2:16Jérôme EltabetYeah. Okay.

2:18Jawad MirAnd I just thought it was so well encapsulated…

2:22Jérôme EltabetYeah

2:22Jawad Mir... How someone's, someone goes up in their career and then it comes down just by focusing on that. So bravo, well done.

2:33Jérôme EltabetThat wa… that was kind of a difficult sequence to edit as well, one of those one which, took us lots of time to get the point where we wanted to go to go where we wanted to get. But happy about that you did enjoy it. Yeah, so.

2:51Jawad MirWell, tell me, before we c… get on to…

2:54Jérôme EltabetYeah

2:54Jawad Mir... The Substance, I would love to know, I'm always fascinated and interested in people's journey as to where they are and how they got to where they are. So just tell me about like the beginnings of your, you know, interest in filmmaking and, in cinematography and all that.

3:13Jérôme EltabetSo, yeah, I did started, my, cinema school, like, after I became bachelor. And, I started to work as an assistant director for quite few years, like, maybe five or something. I was like second assistant or s… something like this, someone first or so sometime, And, I was working with a kind of great director, Alain Franchet, an old, advertising, director, and, who had an Oscar I think in the past and who had a brilliant career. And, but after a little while, he didn't have any more job, any more work for me. So one friend of mine was an editor, asked me if I wanted, if I wanted to take his place as an assistant. So mo… you know, in a way I didn't have too much choice because I needed to have work and to get money, so I went there. And, at the beginning, I was very, I was not happy at all.

4:16Jérôme EltabetFor maybe, six months or even more, I was missing so much, you know, the filming process and to meet lots of people and to be, so I had to be on my own in front of a computer and things like this. But anyway, little by little, I start to enjoy, this work as an editor. And, a few years after, I met Coralie Fargeat. She was a director on a l… little series, and she was al… also one of the actress. It was a kid series. And, she was interested into editing, so I kind of teach her a little bit. And, after we went on and, w… I've been working together on some different project and, on Revenge and, on both, her feature movie.

5:13Jawad MirAmazing. And how did you land onto... Actually, before I do that…

5:20Jérôme EltabetYeah

5:20Jawad Mir... Was there a spec… w… was there a specific movie that you saw as a young man, as a kid, that spoke to you and sort of pushed you in that direction or inspired you?

5:31Jérôme EltabetI have to say, like, my father was a big fan of cinema, and, he used to bring me when I was very young to, in theater. And I remember the first Star Wars. I don't know, Frantic from Polanski, or I don't know, some movie from, when I was like... But the main one I remember, it was at the Grand Rex in Paris, so it's a big theater, a famous one, and there was a kind of festival, a horror festival. And in the same night, I do remember that, we saw, Blue Velvet, from David Lynch, and, And Re-Animator from, I forgot the name of the director, but a v… a great one. So two amazing movie, like, and so, and also the atmosphere was so nice, you know. People are shouting and I don't know. We get a k… a kind of the same atmosphere when we were at Cannes for the premiere of The Substance.

6:32Jérôme EltabetLike, people going out of the... Did not like at all or love it, or this kind of a, it looks a little bit like a rock and roll concert or this kind of thing. It's, I don't know.

6:43Jawad MirYeah.

6:43Jérôme EltabetBut so this experience like, yeah, after in a way I saw the relation between the audience and the movie. It was, I don't know. And I... But maybe the movie w… I was the m… most impressed maybe was The Shining, and I do remember that my parents were not together anymore, I don't know…

7:08Jawad MirYeah

7:08Jérôme Eltabet... And my mother was with a friend. I don't... And she wa… they were watching this on the TV, and me, I was in the stair hi… hidden and wa… and watching it, you know, from far away. Was not supposed to and not allowed to watch it. And I don't know, this moment of, kind, you are kind of scared and at the same time very excited and, so I do remember those moments, that were strong for me. Yeah.

7:33Jawad MirIt's so interesting you talked about The Shining. So…

7:37Jérôme EltabetYeah

7:37Jawad Mir... I'm not gonna reveal about…

7:39Jérôme EltabetYeah

7:39Jawad Mir... Anything about The Substance, but there… ... There i… there is a part towards the last act of the film that when I was watching it, and I... And you know exactly what I'm talking about.

7:49Jérôme EltabetYeah.

7:50Jawad MirI felt reminded of The Shining.

7:53Jérôme EltabetYeah. Well, it…

7:54Jawad MirIt's…

7:54Jérôme EltabetIt's like…

7:55Jawad MirThe editing, the production design, everything

7:58Jérôme EltabetYeah. There is lots o… all this long, corridor and so there is lots of things that,.. But for example, there is some movies that Coralie told me are, those are, those one are reference or, like, Requiem for a Dream, for example, or…

8:15Jawad MirYes. Yes

8:16Jérôme Eltabet... Black Swan or I don't... Or, The Singer. But maybe more The Fly, from Cronenberg and, those. But The Shining she didn't, talk about it, but b… when the movie was over it was so obvious like, some shot really looked the same. And, I think for her, yeah, she maybe a little bit like me, she was so impressed by all those, 70s, 80s movie and, it's, I don't know how you say in English, an homage. I don't know, she,.. But, I think it's, like, i… it's so obvious that i… she doesn't want to hide it, you know? She wants to, it's her way to say, "I love this movie." And what is nice about this, I think the young generation, the young people, when they... Maybe they don't know those old movies, The Shining, I don't know, but like we spoke, we speak about it and on TikTok they see some, on different, social media, and maybe after they say, "Oh, I want to see The Shining.

9:23Jérôme EltabetI want to see this movie because, of that reason." So maybe it's nice thing.

9:28Jawad MirYeah. And again, I actually thought of Requiem for a Dream, like the whole thing about injecting and cutting…

9:35Jérôme EltabetYeah

9:35Jawad Mir... You know, between the sh… I… it had that vibe to it.

9:38Jérôme EltabetYeah.

9:39Jawad MirAnd the sound design was, impeccable. It was amazing. I think sound design really made the film. Also the music, of course.

9:49Jérôme EltabetYeah, sure

9:50Jawad Mir... What were... Was there a specific sequence that you guys had a trouble... Because it's a very tight film, right? It's, like, very… ... Focused on what, Dennis Quaid, who was amazing.

10:04Jérôme EltabetYeah.

10:05Jawad MirYou know, he's like the probably the best character in the film in my view. And, Demi Moore and her younger version…

10:11Jérôme EltabetAnd it was not supposed to be Dennis Quaid. At the beginning…

10:15Jawad MirOh

10:15Jérôme Eltabet... It, yeah, it was supposed to be Ray Liotta. He died…

10:19Jawad MirReally?

10:20Jérôme Eltabet... Just before. Yeah, and he died. So after we had Dennis Quaid, which was a really good choice as well, but, I wonder if it would have been Ray Liotta, I think it would, the movie would have been a bit more darker and a bit more, I don't know. He would have played a different kind of a producer and character maybe.

10:38Jawad MirBut it's interesting you mentioned Ray Liotta…

10:40Jérôme EltabetYeah

10:40Jawad Mir... Because d… I've never seen Dennis Quaid perform like that, right?

10:44Jérôme EltabetYeah.

10:44Jawad MirBut Ray Liotta has done performances like that, so I wonder if the character was written with Ray Liotta in mind, and Dennis Quaid just, you know, obviously made it his own, but at the same time…

10:57Jérôme EltabetM… maybe get this,.. I don't know, but I wonder if, Dennis Quaid, went more in kind of comedy and things like this. I mean, a bit, so sort, really, over the top and

11:14Jawad MirYeah

11:14Jérôme Eltabet... It becomes a bit funny, but I don't know. Yeah.

11:17Jawad MirYeah. Yeah, no, it's, the, it, his... And even, like, the... I'm trying to get to talk, to the production designer, to the DP because the cinematography and those…

11:27Jérôme EltabetYeah, it's amazing

11:28Jawad Mir... W… w… wide frame, like wide angle…

11:30Jérôme EltabetYeah

11:30Jawad Mir... Lens, but, like, really close. Like, it really…

11:33Jérôme EltabetYeah

11:33Jawad Mir... Adds so much to the character.

11:35Jérôme EltabetYeah, that's true

11:36Jawad Mir... What was, what, one of the most challenging…

11:40Jérôme EltabetAre you…

11:40Jawad MirSorry, go on

11:41Jérôme Eltabet... Sequencing? I, no, you asked me before what was the most challenging sequence? I know that…

11:45Jawad MirYes

11:45Jérôme Eltabet... That was the question. Yeah.

11:46Jawad MirYes.

11:47Jérôme EltabetI would say that the, lots of sequence were very challenging. As you said, for example, the walk of fame was not easy to cut because at the beginning Coralie wanted to, that there is no cut at all in this sequence. And now we managed to have the, I don't know, maybe the name of, Demi Moore had, and some black, title, so it helps to shorten the scene, but at the beginning she wanted to, there is no scene. So it's just the born of the walk of fame. I mean, the born of a star, so the… The guy, build the star and so the, and it's all the thing, and after she became a star, and after, as you said, sh… she go d… goes down and everything. But this wa… this, the length of this was, five, six minutes or something like that.

12:42Jawad MirYeah.

12:42Jérôme EltabetIt was very difficult to make it shorter, so we had lots of issue about this kind of thing because, she has been shooting a lot, like, for six months, about, more than 300, hours. About, I think so more than 300 hours. So lots of,.. So, the r… the rough cut was about four hours, and there was, like, 220 sequences. Even the script was very long. So, and she d… she wanted to keep everything, so we had to find a way to make it more, tight and to keep more or less everything. But I would say maybe the most difficult one was, when most all is in the theater and they speak. So I don't want to say too much…

13:36Jawad MirYeah

13:37Jérôme Eltabet... For people who didn't see the movie.

13:38Jawad MirYeah.

13:38Jérôme EltabetBut this one was o… one week of filming and like, four camera, and the, even the most role sometime didn't work very good, you know, with the prosthetic, and, well, now it looks perfect. But we had to choose the best shot because some of them were not, looking not that great, and it was not exactly written like this in the script. It was... So all this thing was a bit of a, kind of a big mess we have to put in place and try to order, and even now it's... But, the good thing is she wanted something like this strong and rock and roll and,.. But for me, it's not my favorite sequence. For me, my favorite one is when Elisabeth, put on makeup, you know, tries to go to her date. And, at the beginning she's kind of very happy about it and excited, and each time she tried to go out, she sees a Sue's poster and the, perfect body.

14:40Jérôme EltabetAnd after sh… so I mean, you see, you know the sequence I'm talking about.

14:45Jawad MirYep.

14:46Jérôme EltabetBut this one I did, was not easy to edit as well because it was a, we have to find the perfect, rhythm and everything. But for me that's like, th… this sequence, it was very moving and, even before she's, in the bathroom tried to give a call to the, to the guy. And, so, I did enjoy this sequence ma… for me. You liked it.

15:14Jawad MirYeah. A… a… and that's, that's the gist of that whole sequence that you're talking about, right?

15:19Jérôme EltabetYeah.

15:19Jawad MirThat's, that sequence itself, let's put the movie aside…

15:23Jérôme EltabetYeah

15:23Jawad Mir... Which is great, by the way. It reflects today's society in such a clear way because, I mean, you look at social... And forget even about, like, anti-aging, right? Like, just in general.

15:34Jérôme EltabetYeah.

15:35Jawad MirPeople look at other people's social media accounts and they're like, "Well, he or she has this. I need to..." You know what I mean? Like that whole thing.

15:42Jérôme EltabetYeah.

15:43Jawad MirAnd it was so... It was just done so beautifully, and obviously creatively with different, you know, angles of approaching it…

15:53Jérôme EltabetYeah

15:54Jawad Mir... That you could relate to it. And also prosthetics. I thought if there was pr… if the prosthetics were CGI…

16:00Jérôme EltabetYeah

16:00Jawad Mir... It wouldn't, it wouldn't have worked. I just thought the prosthetics really…

16:05Jérôme EltabetYeah

16:05Jawad Mir... Made the film as it is.

16:07Jérôme EltabetYeah. Th… this has, had a big value. And also, you know, Elisabeth's apartment supposed to be located in LA. It's not green screen. It's not, LED. She, they used a very old technique, like, they pro… they did proj… they projected a big picture of LA, you know, s… 30 meter on 20, like, so with a big distance. And, it works very good, but every effect there is no, not at all CGI. No CGI, no,.. But that's, because she loves Carpenter's movie. She loves all Cronenberg, all this old movie, and

16:51Jawad MirYeah

16:51Jérôme Eltabet... So she wanted to keep in this, style and it has to be... And as an editor, it's m… much more convenient to work like this because when you work with green screen and all this thing, it's very hard…

17:06Jawad MirYeah

17:06Jérôme Eltabet... To find the thing. And, I guess for the actress was better as well.

17:11Jawad MirIt's, it's, the fact that you mentioned about the LA being a picture…

17:15Jérôme EltabetYeah.

17:15Jawad MirRight? So it di… it didn't even... I don't even think it was a picture.

17:18Jérôme EltabetYeah.

17:18Jawad MirI don't even think it was an LED or…

17:20Jérôme EltabetYeah.

17:20Jawad MirSorry.

17:21Jérôme EltabetYeah

17:21Jawad Mir... Yeah.

17:22Jérôme EltabetOr, yeah, green screen.

17:23Jawad MirBecause…

17:24Jérôme EltabetYeah.

17:24Jawad MirBecause what the focus was Su… Sue's poster.

17:29Jérôme EltabetYeah.

17:29Jawad MirSo every time you look out the window…... The audience, the only thing they see…

17:34Jérôme EltabetYeah

17:34Jawad Mir... Prominently is the poster, and everything else is kind of blurred out, right?

17:38Jérôme EltabetYeah, it's…

17:38Jawad MirSo even the, if the poster wasn't there, people would probably doubt it. So the attention…

17:42Jérôme EltabetAt the beginning it, at the beginning it's not there, you know, at the beginning of the movie. So it's just her by herself.

17:47Jawad MirYeah.

17:48Jérôme EltabetAnd also it's, and also the outside I sh… I filmed in, south of France in Cannes or Nice. And, so it's like everything, is kind of a fantasy about Los Angeles and all these things. So that's a…

18:07Jawad MirYeah

18:07Jérôme Eltabet... A good part of it, yeah.

18:09Jawad MirWere you, on the set with the rushes, or was it everything was finished and then you came on board?

18:16Jérôme EltabetNo, I was not on the set. I began, as the shooting, the filming part was so long, but I began at the middle. I don't exactly remember. I've been working maybe three months or something by my, on my own, but I was not on the, on the set. I was, And, I guess like they were so busy and, so Coralie didn't really want to see anything during this, the filming process and, or a few things, but, some sequences she adored about it, about them. But, well, I only went, twice, tried to meet Demimou, but she was not there inside my way.

19:01Jawad MirThe workflow as an editor…

19:05Jérôme EltabetYeah

19:05Jawad Mir... Whether it was on this film or in general, can you talk about that a bit like in terms of obviously, I mean, there's so many tools out there, Premier, DaVinci…

19:15Jérôme EltabetYeah

19:15Jawad Mir... Avid, right? Which one did you use and what the workflow was like?

19:20Jérôme EltabetOkay. So most of the time for feature movie we use, Avid Media Composer. But as I said, like, we began to work, I began w… to work with Coralie quite a long time a… ago on, some series, and we used to work at this time on Final Cut Pro 7.

19:41Jérôme EltabetAnd

19:42Jawad MirI remember that.

19:44Jérôme EltabetYou remember? That was pretty cool. And Coralie knew this one, and we did edit, Revenge with, Final Cut Pro 7. So every people say, "Oh no, you're crazy. We can't use this anymore. It's out of date," anything. But we manage and after for The Ships, also we went to another software which looks more similar to

20:15Jawad MirFinal Cut

20:15Jérôme Eltabet... Final Cut Pro 7. As for Coralie not to be too... So we went on Premiere Pro and, so that was pretty good. And the good things about Premiere Pro and w… which looks a bit like, Final Cut Pro, it's more intuitive than maybe, Avid Media Composer. So for our kind of work you can just click on something, move it, mute it, I don't know, put a sound, another one, another... So…

20:46Jawad MirYeah

20:47Jérôme Eltabet... And Coralie, when she edit, like put so much stuff, like, yeah, she has, maybe three music at the same time, lots of sound design. So it's like,.. But, this software allow you to do lots of, experiment. It was kind of a experimental work, this post-production. Anyway, yeah.

21:12Jawad MirYeah. So when was the last time you used Final Cut 7?

21:18Jérôme EltabetI think that was for, Revenge. Was it 2017?

21:23Jawad MirYou used Final Cut 7 in 2017. Wow.

21:25Jérôme EltabetY… yeah, not that far away, but I saw that, Parasite, the movie Parasite…

21:31Jawad MirWas edited

21:32Jérôme Eltabet... Was edited also on, Final Cut Pro 7, so. And it was I think at the same time or may… I don't know, maybe before, but. But yeah, the software was not...

21:43Jawad MirWell, you gotta, you gotta render it, number one, right? And then the new machines don't even support that, so you have to use a slow machine.

21:52Jérôme EltabetI,.. No, at the time it was still, between, but we had an old machine, yeah, that's true, and, but as you said, like, that's why, like, the post-production company was not happy at all that we... But that was the one Coralie knew, you know? And, she didn't want to bother to, I don't know. She…

22:14Jawad MirYeah

22:14Jérôme Eltabet... And it was when, it's kind of an efficient one and, so, that was it.

22:22Jawad MirYeah.

22:22Jérôme EltabetBut that's all.

22:24Jawad MirI used Final Cut 2 to 7.

22:29Jérôme EltabetYeah.

22:30Jawad MirThen when Final Cut 10 came out…

22:32Jérôme EltabetYeah

22:32Jawad Mir... I went to Premiere.

22:34Jérôme EltabetYeah. Okay.

22:35Jawad MirAnd then after COVID, I still use Premiere here and there. Now it's DaVinci

22:40Jérôme EltabetYeah

22:40Jawad Mir... And Avid. DaVinci's actually pretty good.

22:43Jérôme EltabetYeah, it looks... I tried, and it looks amazing. Yeah, you can do, yeah, everything and, but i… in a way we didn't really have time to

22:55Jawad MirYeah. You have…

22:56Jérôme EltabetYeah

22:56Jawad Mir... It's a learning curve, right? So, yeah.

22:57Jérôme EltabetYeah, and, she don't, she doesn't want to bother to, so act… she's not really an editor, but she can really, she's good editor, but she doesn't wanna... Yeah, she just want to use the one she knows and…

23:12Jawad MirAmazing. Going back to your dad, you talked about that how he…

23:16Jérôme EltabetYeah

23:16Jawad Mir... Used to love c… love cinema and he used to take you. Two parts to this question. Part one, what was his... Has he ever told you that was it his dream to be in, to work in films in some capacity? And then second, you know, when he found out that you're going in that world, his reaction.

23:38Jérôme EltabetYeah. He never, I s… I think, he loved cinema. Like he was, not, like in the Truffaut movie when he was young, he was not going to school to go to s… to the theater and by himself or stuff like this. But he never tell me, he never said to me he wanted to be, to work in the industry and never told me like he was. But, I'm sure that was his dream and, but, like, the one really nice moment we had together, like, maybe two or three mo… I don't know, a few months ago, now he became a president of a audience association in Le Méliès, which is, the biggest, theater, public theater in France, I think one of the biggest.

24:34Jawad MirWow.

24:35Jérôme EltabetAnd, for the release of, For the premiere of, The Substance. So we had a chat together in front of the audience, and, I was able to thanks my dad for, that I was able to be here tonight and to have the…

24:54Jawad MirWow

24:54Jérôme Eltabet... The chance to work on The Substance and because of him and everything, so that was very, a cute and nice moment, and we have, this kind of a connection.

25:05Jawad MirThat's incredible. That's really nice to hear. Thanks for sharing that.

25:08Jérôme EltabetYeah.

25:08Jawad MirI appreciate that. In terms of The Substance, now the film… ... Was premiered at Cannes, right?

25:16Jérôme EltabetYeah.

25:16Jawad MirBefore it got to Cannes, before it was shown at Cannes… ... Did you guys feel that you have something special?

25:28Jérôme EltabetWhat happened is, me, when I... At the beginning I thought there is, there was something special because the actress for me was amazing. Everything, the filming, the shot, the, s…

25:45Jawad MirProduction design

25:46Jérôme Eltabet... Yeah, production design. For me, it's, it's, it's obvious that this movie is going to be crazy, but it was really long to edit. And little by little the producer, kind of, at the beginning they did enjoy the movie as well, and I was... I don't know what happened. And little by little they started to say, "Oh, it's too long. Very too long. It's too much. It's too something, too something." And, so it started to have kind of, not fight, but, like it looked like they didn't have the same view of the, on the movie than us. And, so I don't know if you know the story, but at the beginning it was, Universal Studio who…

26:36Jawad MirOh

26:37Jérôme Eltabet... Yeah, who put the money. And through a working title, the production company in London…

26:43Jawad MirYeah

26:44Jérôme Eltabet... So and little... And, Coralie, and she's, I think she speak about this somewhere, but she went to show the movie at, Universal Studio in LA, and they did... I don't know, they didn't like the movie. They said, "Ah, no, I don't,.." I don't know why. It was maybe at th… this time still a bit too long, but they said it's a bit too much. And little by little they wanted, to change a little bit the movie, you know, to make it a bit more, for a bigger audience, for a large audience, I don't know. But Coralie like, was really strong in her mind, say, "No, that's the movie." She spent five years to whatever, to write the script, to go there, and she didn't want to, at the end, you know, like,.. So I don't know.

27:44Jérôme EltabetAnd the luck we had is, Thierry Frémaux at Cannes Film Festival that took the movie in the, in competition, official competition. And at this point, just before, Universal Studio tried to sell the movie to some other, to StudioCanal, to... And they didn't... I don't know what happened. But when we were, in selection at Cannes Film Festival, MUBI came. They bought the movie, before we had the prize, the award for Best Script. And after the movie went on with MUBI. But it was really a s… crazy story, and it was really a matter of, luck maybe or matter of, Cannes Film Festival or I don't know what. But we were really close that because the movie didn't have the same life and the same recogn… recognition. I don't know. So it was really a crazy story. So that's why now we are so happy about it, and it's the revenge for Coralie is there.

28:49Jawad MirI was supposed to see,.. I live in Toronto, so I was supposed to see…

28:55Jérôme EltabetOkay

28:55Jawad Mir... I was at TIFF, and I ha…

28:57Jérôme EltabetOkay

28:57Jawad Mir... And I had the pass for it. And I…

29:02Jérôme EltabetMidnight Madness? It was the Midnight Madness?

29:05Jawad MirYeah.

29:05Jérôme EltabetYeah.

29:06Jawad MirAnd I think because it was Midnight Madness, because I, that day I had seen four films…

29:10Jérôme EltabetOkay

29:11Jawad Mir... And I was so tired, I'm like, "I don't think I…

29:14Jérôme EltabetYeah

29:14Jawad Mir... I'll probably fall asleep in the movie theater." But it's so... I'm glad you shared that story. So in terms of the longer cut, right? The director's cut, if that's what it was.

29:27Jérôme EltabetYeah.

29:27Jawad MirIs there some couple of scenes that you c… are able to talk about…

29:31Jérôme EltabetYeah

29:32Jawad Mir... That were taken out that were very good as a scene and added to the story, but obviously you had to make the film tighter?

29:42Jérôme EltabetTh… there was, the agent character. So at the beginning... But it w… it was, it didn't, was not, it didn't add so much stuff, so. But at the beginning, after Denis squared, eat his shrimps and, fire, her…

30:04Jawad MirYeah

30:04Jérôme Eltabet... She went to, she was supposed to go to see her agent, and her agent was kind of say, "Ah, sorry about it, but I think, we don't have any more work for you." So it was a bit, it was not, it w… was, you know, not bad, but it was a bit the same story we had before. And after, later on, when it was through a big success and everything, so you have like three agent, who come to see her, say, "Oh, you're so amazing. We want to work with you." So you have the two part of the... But for And maybe few, but not that much. Coralie wanted to keep more or less everything, so we managed to, as I said, to make it more tight and cut and, make it shorter. But, apart from this, there is not that much things, when

30:58Jawad MirNothing valuable

30:59Jérôme Eltabet... I don't think so.

31:03Jawad MirYeah. In your, in your view about... See, the thing is I have... I don't remember when Demi Moore came into a film last time. I think it's... She probably did, but it wasn't anything major.

31:17Jérôme EltabetYeah. But…

31:21Jawad MirIs she her perf… I mean, she is a main character, her character is a main character, but she's not the main actress. I mean, it's her and I forget the other lady's name.

31:31Jérôme EltabetEmma MacRory.

31:33Jawad MirYes. Yes.

31:33Jérôme EltabetNo?

31:34Jawad MirYeah. Yeah. They both, they both were remarkable. They both had good…

31:38Jérôme EltabetYeah

31:38Jawad Mir... Chemistry and animosity. I wonder because Demi Moore, she won the Golden Globe and she cried…

31:45Jérôme EltabetYeah

31:45Jawad Mir... That, how she said that, "it took me 45 years to win an award."

31:50Jérôme EltabetYeah.

31:50Jawad MirRight? And I wonder if it was somebody else in that character probably who didn't have that same arc in their life about the ups and downs… ... And being forgotten, if it would've been any different, because I think that it came from inside, 'cause she was going through, she wa… she probably felt, went through that in her career.

32:12Jérôme EltabetYeah, totally true. I think, I don't think it was, Coralie first choice, but… ... When the studio, propose, Demi Moore and talk about this, I th… I think, and later on when I knew about it, to me it was obvious that it was a, like, as you said, it's a bit her story, you know, it's a little bit,.. So for sure she will be, she will feel the story. She will play and feel the thing.

32:44Jawad MirYeah.

32:44Jérôme EltabetAnd also when you listen to her, talking about the movie, talking about, she talks so well about it, you know, she really,.. So you can understand, like, the movie touched some part of herself, you know, so was, so there is a true connection between, her and the movie and the story.

33:07Jawad MirYeah. And to me, I mean, there are some gr… amazing, such amazing, great moments, but one character, I forget the character's name, her high school friend or university friend…

33:19Jérôme EltabetYeah

33:20Jawad Mir... I thought that was beautifully done because you have, 'cause it's like an outsider…

33:27Jérôme EltabetYeah

33:27Jawad Mir... Which is the audience, connecting to her. And then when he called her, or she called him…... And he goes in state of shock twice, right?

33:36Jérôme EltabetYeah. That's it.

33:37Jawad MirI really thought that was so brilliantly well executed because, you know, here she's trying to, someone who's superstar…

33:47Jérôme EltabetYeah

33:47Jawad Mir... Talking to an ordinary person who she's forgotten, and now she needs him, and he's in state of shock.

33:53Jérôme EltabetYeah, that's true.

33:53Jawad MirI just, I just thought it was so beautifully done. It was very well crafted.

33:57Jérôme EltabetYeah. Yeah. True, because at the beginning you say, yeah, as you say, he said like, "Oh, you're so famous," da. And then after, like, yeah. As you say, it's a good, yeah, it's a resume of the movie. It's g… it's kind of a... Yeah.

34:11Jawad MirYeah.

34:11Jérôme EltabetYeah.

34:12Jawad MirJust to kind of go back

34:14Jérôme EltabetYeah

34:14Jawad Mir... As we wrap things up, in terms of the workflow, how many, how many... What was your team like? Well, how big was your team and what was…

34:22Jérôme EltabetYeah

34:22Jawad Mir... Like, you know, w… is it, like, an assistant editor kind of going through and logging stuff and taking notes, figuring out the best takes? Like, just talk to me about the technical aspect of it.

34:32Jérôme EltabetOkay. As, so at the beginning we had, my assistant Jimmy Zaou, was really efficient because we had to deal with, Engla… English people, American people, French. So it was really an inter… international production, and lots…

34:51Jérôme Eltabet... Of people everywhere. So we had to make sure that, okay, everything understand the workflow and it's okay. So after that was, set up, I started to work on my own, after Coralie came. So what happened is, as I said, as she edit herself, so we have, she has her own edit room. I have my own one, and the assistant had his own one as well. But as... And we were supposed to have a great sound designer like Nicolas Becker, s… great people for l… lots of things. But in fact, we understood that going to be very long to edit. Like, it took us, maybe more than one year, and it took us, like, two years, but one year in a whole, I would say. Or, so little by little some people who were supposed to work with us were not available anymore.

35:55Jérôme EltabetBut just some team after some teams stay with us. But so it was re… so after we did not need any more assistant because we were just working on our, on our own. So it was kind of a, like, every day together, each one in his editing room, like, s… spending 10 years trying to find. And maybe w… for the walk of fame, we, I have 180, different, version of the same sequence, you know? And after we had another editor who came to help us, Valentin Ferron, because after a while you need someone who was more back, who can see from a larger perspective. So… So it was kind of really experimental, and the movie was ready, like, one day before the premiere of Cannes, you know? And, the mixing studio were not available anymore, so we have to do the mixing in, Corse, Corsica, the small island…

37:02Jérôme Eltabet... Part of France. So, you know, it was a bit of a crazy, a crazy journey, I would say. And, but the main thing is, like, Coralie wanted to keep this, rock and roll attitude, and keep it, keep the movie as she had in her mind. And, I think, I think she... The goal is here and, yeah. Yeah.

37:25Jawad MirYeah. I'm just gonna check

37:27Jérôme EltabetYeah

37:27Jawad Mir... How many, how many Oscar nominations it has.

37:30Jérôme EltabetFive.

37:31Jawad MirIt had five.

37:31Jérôme EltabetFive or six.

37:32Jawad MirYeah.

37:33Jérôme EltabetYeah.

37:33Jawad MirAside from you wanting it to win, obviously all of them, do you... W… what do you feel that it's gonna happen? Like, do you think it's gonna w…

37:46Jérôme EltabetTo me... Yeah, to me, sh… maybe she's going to get the director's one. And maybe Demi Moore is going to get one for as the best actress, and w… and maybe the makeup. Because the two other one are the best film. I don't think that for a jo… this kind of film could win a best film.

38:11Jawad MirYeah

38:11Jérôme Eltabet... But why not, huh? But not sure about it. And, best script, well, she already win it in Cannes, so but, so the, so... And also, I don't know, but she's the only woman, you know, in the selection. So, if there is no... It's not

38:32Jawad MirYeah.

38:33Jérôme EltabetBut I think she deserve the best director, best, because, she did such an amazing work and, on this movie or about this, so yeah, I think she deserve it.

38:46Jawad MirI…

38:47Jérôme EltabetAnd to me, Demi also deserve or something.

38:49Jawad MirYeah. But I'm very surprised that it wasn't nominated for production design and sound design…

38:54Jérôme EltabetYeah

38:54Jawad Mir... Because those were two key elements. And even cinematography, I would say. And e… e… everything

39:00Jérôme EltabetEverything.

39:00Jawad Mir... Editing, right? Like, it was just…

39:02Jérôme EltabetYeah

39:02Jawad Mir... It's, it's, it's a picture that, the reason it's the best picture, because everything worked.

39:08Jérôme EltabetYeah.

39:09Jawad MirSo I'm really surprised that it kinda missed out on those four categories, but you know, sometimes the Academy Awards are not really,.. Yeah, it's, it's sometimes it gets, goes in the, it po… it becomes political and, but w… that's a different…

39:22Jérôme EltabetYeah

39:22Jawad Mir... Discussion altogether.

39:23Jérôme EltabetYeah, I guess. And, yeah, a bit sad about it, but still very happy about it. To have five nomination, even if it's not editing or sound or anything, it's still, it's a great…

39:36Jawad MirYeah

39:36Jérôme Eltabet... Achievement for the movie and for the, for the crew.

39:38Jawad Mir100%.

39:39Jérôme EltabetYeah.

39:40Jawad MirHas your, has your career trajectory changed a little bit? Are you getting more offers for different work that you…

39:47Jérôme EltabetNot yet, but I hope so.

39:49Jawad MirOkay.

39:50Jérôme EltabetBut not yet.

39:52Jawad MirI hope so, too. I think, I think after the Oscars you will. Because I truly feel, again, I mean, Requiem for a Dream, The Shining…

40:01Jérôme EltabetYeah

40:01Jawad Mir... All those amazing films, and... But this one, even though it borrows the inspirations from it still had its own voice, and that's what makes it so unique, and you must be really, you sh… you must be, and if not, you should be really proud of it.

40:17Jérôme EltabetThank you. Thank you so much. Yeah.

40:20Jawad MirA… and, yeah, no, this has been great. I would love to chat with you again, in the near future hopefully.

40:28Jérôme EltabetOkay.

40:28Jawad MirAnd maybe we can do this again. Thank you so much, Jerome…

40:31Jérôme EltabetOkay, thank you

40:32Jawad Mir... For your time.

40:32Jérôme EltabetIt was brilliant.

40:32Jawad MirThank you for making the film.

40:34Jérôme EltabetN… nice chat. Okay.

40:36Jawad MirTake care.

40:36Jérôme EltabetOkay, bye-bye.

40:37Jawad MirBye-bye.