'Directing 'Bridgerton' Finale, Anya Adams

0:00Jawad MirTo you, what is purpose of life?

0:01Anya AdamsWhat comes to mind is connection. The silence is not me saying I never have fear, 'cause for sure, stepping into a, into any show as a newcomer, joining a family, it's really trepidatious.

0:13Jawad MirWhere does your creativity, your own creativity come in, and then there's that boundary of making sure that it aligns with the show needs and the character needs?

0:22Anya AdamsThat's a great question.

0:23Jawad MirAlso factoring in that you used to be an AD, because AD is sort of…

0:27Anya AdamsYeah

0:27Jawad Mir... Doing... So how do you find that gap between…... Used to being an AD and then, you know, trying not to overstep?

0:34Anya AdamsI mean, I think I probably overstep at times, and that's just, like, a default that happens when you're stressed.

0:39Jawad MirIf there's a place in the world that you wanna travel to the most?

0:42Anya AdamsGalapagos Islands. I feel like in America now, and Canada a little bit, we're trying to get back to w… there's this, like, exclusivity, like…

0:52Jawad MirClub

0:53Anya Adams... But it's really distilled in the Lun… the English, culture.

1:06Jawad MirGood morning, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of Kingdom of Dreams podcast, The Making of Stories. I'm your host, Jawad Mir. Today my guest is director Anya Adams, who was behind the episode seven and eight of Netflix series Bridgerton season four. What a great conversation it was. What a great guest she was to have on this show. We talked about blocking. We talked about working with actors. We talked about life. We talked about class. We talked about so many exciting things. So without further ado, here is my conversation with director Anya Adams. Enjoy. Talk to me about your, a little bit of your career, just very briefly. I went through your IMDb, and sometimes that information is not 100% accurate. You had done a lot of different television series in the past and, in the last seven, eight, 10 years, and this was your first Bridgerton, sort of taking on. Talk to me how you got into this industry, what sort of inspired you, the catalyst behind it.

1:58Anya AdamsWell, I started in live entertainment. I used to be a part of a group called Up With People, so I traveled around the world and did live entertainment. And, as I was kind of winding down in that career, I was thinking, "W… how can I get into television?" And I, found this program called the Directors Guild of America Trainee Program. So I jumped onto that. It's a very rigorous application process, but I got in. And so that process trains you to be an assistant director, so I started in this industry as an assistant director. And kind of worked my way through a bunch of different shows, ending on, a show called CSI: Miami that used to be, like, you know…

2:43Jawad MirYep

2:43Anya Adams... The big hit back in the day. And so I kind of made my jump from a trainee to an AD on CSI: Miami, and worked there for a bit. Worked my way up to first AD basically on that show, and then, started looking for other opportunities, also kind of leaning on the fact that I like to laugh. I'm a big comedy fan, so trying to kind of worm my way into that world. And so I was able to do that and worked on a bunch of shows you can see on my IMDb. But, my, the last show or the catalyst show for me, one, in moving into directing was a TV show called The Mindy Project. I worked on that show as an AD and really was thinking about, "What's my next move?" And the trajectory for an AD is like you can be a production m… manager or you can, you know, go into the creative. The creative is a little bit more difficult. I chose the more difficult route.

3:43Anya AdamsSo, I actually asked Mindy, I, you know, I tell this story a lot. I said, I said to her, like, "Hey," 'cause I'd seen her giving other people opportunities, so I had asked her, I was like, "Look, I wanna direct, you know. Would you give me a chance?" And she said, "Absolutely. What have you done?" And I was like, "Yeah, I haven't done anything, so I should probably do that." So I, in the process of trying to figure out what to do, I actually jumped shows and moved on to Black-ish. And so when I got on Black-ish, I did a short film with Marsai Martin, called Lemonade Mafia, and that and my conversations with producers, Kenya Barris, really moved me into a space where Kenya gave me an episode. So I directed, my first episode of television was Black-ish, and from there I made the jump into a bunch of comedy directing. I worked with, a producer named Melvin Mar who ran, Speechless and Fresh Off the Boat, and so I got opportunities to direct on those shows.

4:48Anya AdamsAnd from there, really what I've tried to do is build my career into something where people look at me as a director of, a good director, not necessarily a director of comedy or a director of drama, because you can get really pigeonholed in this industry.

5:02Jawad MirYeah.

5:02Anya AdamsL…

5:02Jawad Mir100%, 100%. Even, not in genre, but even as a particular job, like once you start doing, like, let's say editing, and then if you wanna become a director it becomes very hard to…

5:14Anya AdamsYes

5:14Jawad Mir... Make that transition, unless you have your own project, right?

5:17Anya AdamsYeah., Or you have people that see that, see you know, wanna give you the opportunity, which is what happened for me on Black-ish. I don't, if Kenya hadn't have, you know, said, "Yes, let's give Anya a chance," it would've been really difficult. I mean, I would've had to keep making my own pe… you know, projects, which people do. But it's really nice to be able to break in with a family you know, 'cause that's w… what happened with me. I was really supported by the crew as I stepped into that role, and the cast.

5:48Jawad MirNice.

5:48Anya AdamsYeah.

5:49Jawad MirNice. So fast-forward, I would imagine maybe m… early last year or two years ago, you get a call to be on Bridgerton.

5:57Anya AdamsYeah.

5:57Jawad MirA series, a b… series that, you know, by the end of season two I think, even season one had become pretty big, and, you know, there was a big sort of wait,... Fans waiting for season three and four to come out. So you get this call, and you had never done Bridgerton before. It's a big Netflix series. And on top of that, episode seven and eight, which are kind of like…

6:17Anya AdamsYeah

6:17Jawad Mir... The finale. Talk to me, talk to me through that, how that, how that went.

6:22Anya AdamsI was, I mean, I was super honored to even be considered, and then to be given the finale block of a much anticipated season was really exciting to me. And, you know, it's a big deal to do this show because it also shoots in London, which is amazing. I think it's really fun. Like I'm shooting in New York right now. You know, you tell people, "I'm shooting in New York," and everyone thinks, if they don't live there, that it's a vacation, you know, you're going on vacation, but you're really going to work. So, that was a little daunting, you know, 'cause I was in London from February until June, beginning of June. So you uproot your life for a major amount of time. You're not around your friends and family. You know, you have your good days and your bad days, but you're kind of in another space. So that was, that was really a daunting thing, like thinking about, you know, what is that gonna be like?

7:22Anya AdamsWhat's great about Bridgerton is you step into a family that's super welcoming. They've been there from the beginning. They, everyone's so, rallied around the characters and the storytelling and the show that, you know, newcomers are welcomed, and, you know, really helped to fit in. And so I really felt, I f… I felt really comfortable and happy when I got there.

7:54Jawad MirNice. Let's talk about you as a d… you as a director and the workflow. Everybody, every director, you know, from a standpoint of, blocking, from the standpoint of, working with actors, production designer, costume designer, cinematographers, has a different aesthetic to it.

8:10Anya AdamsYeah.

8:10Jawad MirSo taking on a series where all these characters have been established over the last, you know, four season, God knows what, 20 plus, 30 plus episodes, and you come in and you have this big responsibility to be able to sort of deliver the messaging of this, episode, in the season. How do you work with actors that have sort of been working with other directors, whether it's in case of Bridgerton or anything else? Because, you know, with a film or TV pilot that you are just working on as a director, it's a little bit different because you're starting off fresh, but now you're taking…

8:46Anya AdamsYeah

8:46Jawad Mir... On all this existing stuff. Where does your creativity, your own creativity come in? And then there's that boundary of making sure that it aligns with the show needs and the character needs.

8:58Anya AdamsYeah. That's a great question. I think, I mean, one of the things I feel about the Bridgerton cast is they're really excited to work with different directors because it, really helps them, work. It helps them stretch their skillset, you know, taking notes from different people, you know, learning to kind of disseminate what somebody's saying to you and execute that, can be very exciting. So I think they enjoy, having the different directors, the different energy come in because the o… the other thing is that if you have the same people all the time all the way through, it can get a little stale or a little, you know, rote. Whereas if you have new ideas coming in, it, I think, galvanizes and adds a new energy, a freshness. So, what I like to do when I step into a place like that is, I like to kind of meet the director, the actors beforehand.

10:00Anya AdamsSo whether it's a Zoom call or in person, I like to just go and meet them so that they can see who I am and tell me, you know, a little bit about themselves and also their character if it's something like Bridgerton where it's very established. Like, what are things that you know, wish that your character had been highlighted more? What are things that I can know when we're, when I'm shooting with you that can help with your character? Or how you like to, how you like to work, for example, like, you know, when we're doing a scene, do you like to have notes right away? Do you need a couple of takes to get into your work, you know, flow? What's your kind of process? I like to ch… have those conversations with them offset beforehand so that, we kind of can start creating a relationship together, but also I can go in a little bit more informed about how they like to work so that when you get into the pressure cooker of like, you only have 30 minutes to get this and whatever, I kind of have an idea of how they like to work, and so can move in that, in that way with them.

11:08Anya AdamsSo that's usually kind of what I do in terms of prep for the actors. I also, you know, obviously watch every episode and really try to get a feel for the show and how the show may have changed over the seasons and what they're doing more and what they're doing less. And also, like when you step into this show, you have an incredible usually DP, which I had in Alicia. So she and I, you know, w… went through the scripts and really, talked about how we wanted to shoot the different scenes. And if I was ever thinking of something that might have been out of the ordinary for the Bridgerton look or feel, she could always kind of redirect me or give me another op… op… option. One of the things we did in this, my episodes that I don't think I've seen in Bridgerton before was, like when Benedict, spoiler,...

12:14Anya AdamsProposes to Sophie i… at the ball, we kind of did this lighting shift, and everybody kind of s… stopped moving. And that was because for me it was really important to make a moment of this, the proposal, and the script kind of said, "Well, he proposes, you know, he takes her off the floor and he proposes," but, like, I kind of had felt like this, the entire season we've been waiting for this, for the proposal, for the marriage, for this consummation, publicly of their romance. And so, you know, we talked a lot about how do we do that in the time that we have and the space that we have that makes sense in the storytelling. So there's a lot of kind of y… it's really fortuitous when you step on a show like that to have a DP that's been there before, 'cause they can really help you with pitfalls of where you've been and where you haven't, and where we can push the, push the limits, and I feel like that's one of the moments where we might have done that.

13:19Jawad MirThat's awesome. Yeah, no, that scene really stood out. Again, it's just these little things that from a creative standpoint that every individual, you know, whether it's a collaboration, right, whether it's a collaboration between the director and the cinematographer sort of inserts, and it becomes, comes to life more than it was on life on paper.

13:39Anya AdamsYeah. No

13:40Jawad Mir... You know, you talked about, Alicia, and you know, the thing is when you're on the set, the four departments that you are sort of leading the ship on are the camera department, the costume department, and the set department, right? And how is your... You kind of already spoke about the camera department, so working with costume and set as a captain of the ship, how are you sort of managing that and also factoring in that you used to be an AD? Because AD is sort of…... Doing... So how do you find that gap between…... Used to being an AD and then, you know, trying not to overstep? You know what I'm saying?

14:22Anya AdamsYeah. I mean, I think I probably overstep at times, and that's just, like, a default that happens when you're stressed or in the moment, and, you know, you used to do something and you did... I did it well, and so, you know, you f… you fall back into those roles sometimes. But I really try to endeavor to let the AD-ing stuff happen with the AD. But I do feel like it helps me with questions and with, the, in the prep moments, you know, 'cause the ADs are responsible for the schedule. So, like, really being able to articulate, "I'm gonna need longer for this scene than you have on paper. Maybe we can move this stuff around," and, you know, having that brain for that is helpful as a director. But the other two departments, so the thing that's kind of interesting about this is we... So the two episodes that I shot were set in locations that are already fixed, right?

15:29Anya AdamsExcept for, when we went to, oh gosh, Cressida's house. Cressida is in a new home. And so, but, I don't know how to say this, or w… or how to... Essentially, when you s… when Bridgerton starts prep, they need to have all the episodes kind of fleshed out so that the product… like, production design and costume design know the arc of the season so they can start prepping.

16:01Jawad MirSure.

16:01Anya AdamsBecause those things, it's not like being on NCIS: Origins where you're like, "Let's go to Target and just grab a couple T-shirts."

16:10Jawad MirYeah.

16:10Anya AdamsThey have to build. And I, if you've... Like, as a director going there, one of the cool things that you get to do is walk through, I should send you this, but you get to walk through, like, the costume department warehouse, which is, like, not a warehouse. It's two huge warehouses with different levels, and on level two is the queen's realm, and that is the person that paints on the queen's stuff, and the person that is building the little diamonds that g… you know, there's just so much work that goes into it. The costume designer h… John has to, like, you know, he needs a big runway. So when I'm starting, they've already kind of started conceptualizing. And so you as a director have input in kind of what the, where the ball's going, but it's already kind of going, right? Like, if you step on and you know, like, this is gonna be a, this, ball is this themed, they're kind of already ki… going that way.

17:13Anya AdamsSo you get to have a conversation about it, but you're not necessarily, like, conceptualizing what the ball is, if that makes sense.

17:21Jawad MirIt does. It does.

17:22Anya AdamsWhat I find that's really cool about the costume de… department on this show is that they spend, you know, incredible amounts of time building these beautiful costumes, and then every season those costumes get repurposed. So even though you might not see them on the main characters again, they get rebuilt and repurposed and put on the background so that the f… the s… everything's reused and reused and reused, because of budget, but also because, you know, those things are incredible. And, like, why not recreate them or repurpose them into something, that will augment the beauty of the background of a scene?

18:06Jawad MirSure. No, that's smart.

18:08Anya AdamsStuff you get to, like, be a part of, trying to think of, like the… One of the things that was different for me that they hadn't really done on Bridgerton before was a funeral. So what does that look like? Things in… so understanding what that, what a funeral looks like or a funeral wake looks like at that time, so having a concept of that, and then trying to build on that in a, artistic way. So like, you know, the sheers over pictures and like, you know, featuring that kind of look. Like Amy, who directed episode six, kind of ends on the portrait of, Hannah and her husband John, of Francesca and John. A… and then when I have it's covered with like, you know, a dark kind of see-through, piece of material to kind of sh… show the funeral feel, but also, you know, show the passage of time and so on.

19:11Anya AdamsSo that kind of stuff I get to have a conversation about. Like how opaque do I want that material, that kind of thing. And you get, you know, you definitely get to say like, "I'd like this kind of tea set or these kind of, this kind of food, you know, on the tables." but in general, bec… you know, how they've kind of created from season one, those things stay fairly fixed.

19:42Jawad MirFair enough. Got it.

19:43Anya AdamsYeah.

19:43Jawad MirAwesome. Thank you so much. I want to talk about if this whole show is about class system, if you want to call it… ... Right? Like the upper class, the lower class, being ostracized, middle class, all that stuff. You know, I was watching that episode and I was thinking, "Thank God we don't live in that world," but then it kind of hit me…... We kind of st… we kind of still do in a very sophi…

20:07Anya AdamsYeah

20:07Jawad Mir... We kind of in a very sophisticated way. At least in the West it's a little bit more sophisticated. In other parts of the world it's not. How do you... Do, in your experience in life, have you witnessed something like that and that kind of in a conscious or unconscious way got applied into your work on Bridgerton? Where, you know, whether it's a friend or somebody you knew who were about to get together but then there was some sort of a difference, whether it was because of financials, whether…

20:40Anya AdamsOh. Yeah, I don't, I... You know what's so interesting about Thi… Bridgerton versus like the Amer… living in America is that, you know, that feeling of American dream where you can, you can transcend class, based on an idea or, you know, some financial gain some way, or you can kind of move through the classes.

21:03Jawad MirSure.

21:03Anya AdamsThat is so not, that's so fixed in Lon… in the European, especially the English kind of world. I've never exper… I didn't, I've never experienced anything. I'm, I'm actually from Canada. I grew up in Vancouver, on the…

21:18Jawad MirOh, did you?

21:19Anya AdamsYeah. I'm Canadian by birth, and so, you know, we're very connected to the English way of life, but I think we still subscribe to this, you know, American ideal where you can supersede a class. So I've never experienced anything like that. One of the things I really love about this season that, you know, people don't realize is like... And I was like feeling this way too when I was first reading the scripts, was like, "Come on, Benedict, you can't tell it's Sophie?" Like, come on. There was a mask, you can't tell? But the whole idea of that upstairs downstairs and how the downstairs would never, like that would never be a possibility, so I would never look at somebody that way because that's just not even, that's not even gonna happen. I feel like that is so fixed in, or was so fixed in the English society. I don't think I've ever, I've ever kind of seen that happen here.

22:24Anya AdamsI…

22:24Jawad MirI think, I think you're right because if you look at, the countries that were ruled by the British, right? Like if you go to India, if you go to Pakistan, if you go to all these… ... Different countries, that element is still there.

22:38Jawad MirStill there. I was in, I was in London, last year, and I was meeting a potential investor for one of my next projects. And he says, "No, come to this club," and he never told me what the dress code was.

22:51Anya AdamsOh. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

22:53Jawad MirSo I go in with, I go in with my jeans and the guy, the…

22:56Anya AdamsOh no

22:56Jawad Mir... The do… the doorman is like, "You can't come in." I'm like, "What do you mean I can't come in?" "You're not dressed appropriately."

23:02Anya AdamsYeah.

23:02Jawad MirAnd then, but then I was able to kind of come in and just at the main foyer and kind of chat. But that aspect, those exclusive clubs, they have those kind of rules because you just have to... I don't know if it's a financial class, but it's just you have to look at least at the same level as everybody else.

23:17Anya AdamsYeah. Yeah. I think like it's so interesting 'cause I feel like in America now, and Canada a little bit, we're trying to get back to... W… there's this like, e… ex… exclusivity like…

23:33Jawad MirClub

23:34Anya Adams... Yeah, feeling where people are like the Soho House and the, this club and that club, and you know, people are trying to define themselves by what group they're a part of, which may be just a human thing. But it's really distilled in the Lon… the English kind of, culture. And there are clubs there that neither of us will ever be able to touch, no matter how wealthy we get because of our pedigree, you know? It's, it's, it's very different. It's very different. Yeah.

24:08Jawad MirY… you talked about…

24:09Anya AdamsI would say actually…

24:10Jawad MirLike a…

24:10Anya Adams... In the States, the difference is, racism. Like, I mean, and I'm sure Pakistan and India, there's that there too.

24:18Jawad MirOh, 100%.

24:18Anya AdamsBut the whole, the whole idea of, like, Black/white relationships, I feel like I've encountered that more, which isn't upstairs downstairs. It's more kind of racial divide, but that also I think is present in, you know, the English lifestyle. And Shondaland is just so great at doing this color-blind casting where it just allows everyone to see themselves in the space.

24:44Jawad MirYeah

24:44Anya Adams... We haven't been able to before.

24:47Jawad MirBut I believe that, and, I don't know if you have experienced this or not, this, the whole race thing, right? Like, or whatever, religion, race, whatever you wanna call it, all these different difference of opinions, difference of looks and views…

24:58Anya AdamsYeah

24:58Jawad Mir... They kind of f… fade away when... If there's a Black person who's a millionaire, a Brown person who's a millionaire, and a white person's a million… they will be friends.

25:08Anya AdamsYeah.

25:08Jawad MirThat goes away out the window. But as soon as that money part kinda comes down, then sometimes it looks like that and sometimes it is that.

25:19Anya AdamsYeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's true.

25:23Jawad MirJust an observation.

25:25Anya AdamsYeah.

25:26Jawad MirI… I wanna talk about your, the big crowd scenes, right?

25:31Anya AdamsOh.

25:31Jawad MirSo you have... Those are tough to do as a director.

25:35Anya AdamsYeah.

25:36Jawad MirAnd obviously there are other... Your entire team is sort of responsible with the background actors and, you know, the second unit or the assistant director, second assistant director and all that. But as s… as a scene is playing out in front of the camera and your focus is obviously the main characters, has there been any time where you were trying to think in your head, "Holy crap, this take is going great. I hope everything else is going okay"? And if something didn't go okay, what was the sorta story behind that, if that ever happened?

26:06Anya AdamsThat's funny. So the background actor kind of placement and movement is a first, is a, is an AD responsibility.

26:14Jawad MirOkay.

26:14Anya AdamsSo that's something I'm incredibly attuned to in any scene. So it doesn't matter. I can watch the action of the actors, but I'm also very aware of the action of the background. So I'm not gonna lie, I'm sure the back… the AD department was highly annoyed with me. We were shooting, when they were outside of the market, like just when, Lady Danbury and Lady Bridgerton are walking, there was, you know, background action, and I was very specific that day, and I think it's a, you know, it's something that, like, I am just so passionate about and want to make right. So in days like that where you're like, we were, we were on the back lot and there were background, that's a big kind of collaboration with your assistant director, that team, them setting it up, w… them, you telling them what you want, and then, watching. I'm not gonna lie, there are times when I will reset even if it was a good take for the background because everything makes it a good scene, not just the background.

27:22Jawad MirYeah

27:22Anya Adams... I think that they did an incredible job with that, and also at the, at the ball, like the queen's ball, that was a lot of... That required kind of like an overhead plan for us because it was like, you know, Armenta enters here, Sophie enters here. There was, like, a lot of stuff happening in that room, and connecting the flow of everything was really important, so it was really important for the ADs to make sure that when we're on Posey and she's talking to her love interest, that there's a, that if that cross is happening there, it's happening in the other direction, too. It's like keeping that kind of in mind. When we did the wake for John where it was really, all actors, that becomes more my responsibility. Like, as a director, your dir… your responsibility is the actors. So if you have 15 actors in the scene, you're placing them and setting them versus at the ball where the s… AD department can set the background and the movement and the flow there.

28:31Anya AdamsSo, and I love doing both versions of that, you know?

28:37Jawad MirNo, that's good. At least you're honest. That's really good. I think, I think it's a testament... I think every director is like that.

28:43Anya AdamsYeah.

28:43Jawad Mir'Cause director, directors more or less are, for the lack of better word, a little bit more controlling…

28:48Anya AdamsYeah

28:48Jawad Mir... You know, because you want certain things certain way. And because you have been an AD, it's sort of more in you than maybe…

28:55Anya AdamsYeah

28:55Jawad Mir... Just directors.

28:57Anya AdamsYeah.

28:57Jawad MirYou know, you talked about actors and the positioning. Let's talk about blocking for a minute.

29:02Anya AdamsSure.

29:03Jawad MirWhat's your blocking process, and what was the most challenging scene on any of those two episodes that you found really, you know, it was challenging to block, and if there's a story behind it that you can share?

29:19Anya AdamsI mean, what comes to mind is the wake at the Bridgerton house. That took us two days to shoot, and the reason it was challenging is, because there was a flow that needed to happen. So, like, you know, we've got folks at the front door greeting people, and then Mom coming to talk to Francesca, and then Mom talking to her love interest, and then Francesca bringing cookies to her family, and then Francesca seeing... You know, feeling a little bit, overwhelmed, and Sophie see... You know, it was all of these things happening, right? And then where are all of those things in relation to each other? So, like, can Lady Danbury enter the party and then we come back and find her and it makes sense to see her seeing Bri… Benedict over here? So, you know, really, like, how do you sh… how do you block that and then shoot it so people understand kind of spatially where you are?

30:20Anya AdamsI think that was the most challenging. And again, that's another one where the ADs were really working overtime because we had a lot of background in there, and so we're resetting this moment or we're looking at it from a different angle, but we need this wipe to take us there. So I think that was probably the most challenging. What was, what was... I mean, this is very small, but I can bring in, like it's, it was f…

30:44Jawad MirSure

30:44Anya Adams... When Francesca brings the cookies over to her siblings

30:53Jawad MirWhen she forces them to eat? I know exactly what you're talking about…

30:56Anya AdamsYeah

30:56Jawad Mir... Like you should have it, you should have…

30:57Anya AdamsI was just thinking of, when she, when she brings them over, they're all tasting the cookies, but one of the cookies was gluten-free that had to go to, Hyacinth, and so it was very, like when we were, when they're taking it, everybody had to be very aware of what cookie they were taking because she has a gluten allergy and can't eat the, a regular cookie. So you know, how they were placed on the platter, and then seeing them pull them. And then when I was in the edit, w… because it couldn't actually, it couldn't be on the platter, so she had to get something from props, like they had to give her a cookie. So, it was funny because in the edit there were times where I was like, "Oh, she doesn't have a cookie in her hand. Oh, she got the cookie." We have to like kind of…... Cut around that to make it make sense.

31:49Jawad MirYeah.

31:49Anya AdamsBut, that was really funny. That was, that was a kind of s… fun thing. Trying to think of like what else. I will say the cast, when we shot the Kill Martin wake where everyone was dancing, by the end of it the cast was like, "Okay, Anya, we're, we're done with dancing." Like…... "You made us twirl enough. We're, we're good." Like, there was a lot of, "Okay, one more time. Ugh." but I was so happy to shoot that because for me it was like a moment where, I mean, for Bridgerton fans who watch the show, you know, all of the balls are very, you know, Jack, the choreographer, is amazing, but they're, they're very practiced and stayed and upright and, you know, they're not full of wild abandon, which is kind of what I wanted the wake to feel like. That the Bridgertons were kind of letting loose a little bit, which you don't usually see.

32:51Anya AdamsSo, that's the many takes.

32:55Jawad MirYou talked about Francesca and I was not go… get, come to that the, her whole arc in that episode of, you know, losing somebody and then she's trying to deal with it by handing cookies and, you know, she's…

33:07Anya AdamsYeah

33:07Jawad Mir... Like crying. And then eventually she breaks down, right? Later in the episode.

33:12Anya AdamsYeah.

33:12Jawad MirWhat was your talk with Fran… her, the character... Sorry, the character I'm saying. The actress, on that, and I'm sorry I'm really terrible with names…

33:21Anya AdamsHannah

33:21Jawad Mir... Of the actresses. Hannah.

33:22Anya AdamsHa… yeah.

33:23Jawad MirHannah. What was your conversation with her like on her entire, you know, sort of journey in that episode of how to execute? What, were you giving her any notes or any inputs or?

33:36Anya AdamsI think, I mean, this is the time when I say again like these actors at times know the character way better than I could ever do…

33:43Jawad MirThan you

33:43Anya Adams... Stepping into it. You know, obviously watching the show, but she's lived in this character, and in that relationship with John for a while. She and I really talked about, and Jess, the showrunner, about like, you know, Francesca is t… a reserved, kind of nervous young girl. If you, if you watch the whole season, there's a whole bit about her wanting to reach her pinnacle and not knowing how to talk to people about that and the discomfort she feels. I think a lot of people kind of relate to her 'cause she's very, she's just an, a reserved, quiet young woman who does not exude a lot of emotion, and that's also why I think she's connected with John. They're very similar. So you know, another thing that I was reminded of and y… we talked about was that she's quite young. You know, like back in the day these guys got married very young. So she's just trying to keep up the appearances.

34:45Anya AdamsHow am I supposed to be here? And, never having gone through anything that tragic except for losing her father, but she was much younger. So we really talked about how she was controlling herself. At the funeral she's very stoic. It's just like she's just gonna do her job, you know? And it's not until sh… her mom kind of pushes her in a way that kind of breaks the dam for her, and I think a lot of people when watching that, you hear her say, you know, "You had eight chances. You have eight, you know, you had eight reasons. You know, you had eight children, and I have nothing." Like she doesn't have a child. She has nothing to carry on John's love, and that, the weight of that coming cr… crashing out of her, it was fun to talk to her about building that up so that she could let it go, and I think Hannah did an incredible job at that.

35:51Anya AdamsLike, it just was so heartbreaking.

35:55Jawad MirYeah, she did. She was remarkable.

35:58Anya AdamsYeah.

35:58Jawad MirAs we sort of wrap up, I want to ask you about your own sort of, if you want to call them fears of being a director and being on the set, especially like Bridgerton, like, you know, a massive set, like all this responsibility is on your shoulder.

36:15Anya AdamsYeah.

36:16Jawad MirNo ma… no ma… no matter how much you prepare, how much you tell yourself it's gonna be cool, it's gonna be all right…... There's always those moments when the, you know, the fear kind of creeps in. Are there…... Temporarily or throughout your, you know, whatever, three, four months that you were there, five months, was there, if you can talk to me about a moment like that, I'm sure there have been many…... Where you may have been afraid, or self-doubt kinda creeped, you know, came in.

36:42Anya AdamsYeah, let's see. The, this silence is not me saying I never have fear, 'cause for sure, I mean, stepping into a, into any show as a newcomer joining a family, it's really trepidatious. You know, you want to be able to smoothly kind of, assimilate into the workflow, into the family so that you can talk about your v… vision and have people, get on board with it, you know? I mean, honestly it's the first couple of days. First day, the first day I shot I had to shoot a montage piece of Sophie packing up her luggage and, getting ready to leave, you know, at the end of

37:34Jawad MirYeah

37:34Anya Adams... Seven.

37:35Jawad MirYeah.

37:36Anya AdamsAnd leaving the glob and I, and, I hadn't been there very long and I, it was my first epis… first thing to shoot, and we shoot, we shot way too long. So, like, that's a, that's a fear directors have is, like, you wanna be able to execute what you're doing in a appropriate amount of time. So a scene like that is maybe half a page and has, like, a couple of things, you wanna get out of there and, you know, do a good job, and your first day you wanna do a good job. You know, you wanna, you wanna get in, get out, have people happy, have the actors happy that you haven't done, like, 107 takes, you know, you confidently got what you needed. I think that scene took us almost seven hours, and it was, like, probably

38:28Jawad MirIt was very quick. It was a very quick montage, like…

38:30Anya AdamsIt was, it was, like…

38:31Jawad Mir... 40 seconds or something

38:32Anya Adams... I mean, on the page it was like 4/8 of a page or it was a…

38:35Jawad MirYeah

38:35Anya Adams... Very short amount of work. And some people will say, you know, Rome burns is a short amount of work. I mean, it's, it's small on the page but big in manufacturing. This could've been less time. So I definitely, when I shot that, I was like, "Oh, gosh, are they gonna think that I don't know what I'm doing or I take too long shooting?" So that was definitely, like, I did have some trepidation going into the next day that I was shooting. And one of the ways around that was I literally went to the show, the producing director there, Tom Verica, who's amazing, and said, I said to him, you know, like, "I'm aware. I d… I, th… that won't happen again. Like, I think we got..." 'Cause I got kind of... The thing that can happen when you don't feel a time pressure is that you get excited about the craft you're doing and how you're gonna shoot things, and

39:30Jawad MirOh, yeah

39:30Anya Adams... That takes up time. So that's why it's very important as a director to be prepared and to have talked about these things beforehand so when you get on set you can execute what you've, your vision is. And if new ideas come up, that's great, you can incorporate it, but you also, you know, have a drive. So I guess that would be a moment that I was like, "Oh."

39:54Jawad MirVery nice. If there was one thing that you learned about yourself while working on Bridgerton, not necessarily your craft, it can be, but anything in partic… anything else it could be, what would that be?

40:08Anya AdamsI mean, I, yeah, that's a hard one. I mean, I, it reinforced for me how much I love the job. That's not a, that's not a learning thing, but it reinforced for me, like, how much I love directing and how much I feel like I'm in the right place doing it. It's not really something that, like, a learning thing.

40:33Jawad MirNo, that's fine. That's fair enough. I mean, I can relate to that. It's just that you're, y… you kind of feel like you've been reborn.

40:41Anya AdamsYeah. I just, like, sitting there, you know, every day going to work was such a joy. I really love the cast. The crew was magnificent. The, you know, the camera operators, Alicia, like, everybody was just so wonderful to work with and collaborate with. Like, it was such a great environment. It was, it just, it reminded me, like, this is, this can be really fun. 'Cause sometimes it's not, it's stressful…

41:10Jawad MirOh, yeah. Yeah

41:10Anya Adams... Or you have personality clashes or whatever. Yeah.

41:14Jawad MirThat, I'm sure, I'm sure you had tons of those.

41:17Anya AdamsYeah.

41:18Jawad MirWhat's next for you? Are you working on anything that you're able to talk about, or you're waiting for work?

41:23Anya AdamsNo, I am working right now in New York. I'm on The Gilded Age. So…

41:27Jawad MirOkay

41:27Anya Adams... It's kind of a fun thing to be in, a little bit like we were talking about. The Gilded Age, created by Julian Fellowes, very English kind of origins, but it's about, you know, the American Renaissance, the Gilded Age of that, you know, of our time.

41:46Anya Adams... And one of the cool things about it is that this is kind of, the storytelling talks about how you can make yourself in, you can, you can build yourself into the upper class, which is, you know, I think distinctly an American kind of thing. And so…

42:06Jawad MirRight

42:06Anya Adams... It's really fun to be a part of that. So I'm, I'm, I'm doing, a, season four of this show, and it's fun to be working kind of in the same time, you know, but on a different continent.

42:23Jawad MirWhen you say it's kind of fun working on the same time period, could it, is it, are you attracted to that time period aside from, you know, it's, it's a novelty, but…... Sort of being out of the current time that we're in, where everything is like rush, and in that time period…... It's like more like, "Okay, let's just take a breath, take a breather," you know, slowly. Everything moves slowly.

42:49Anya AdamsI l… I mean, I love the pomp and circumstance of, you know, the 1800s. Gilded, Bridgerton's a little bit earlier, but like that, you know, the time when men and women dancing was normal. It's fine, you know, everybody can dance. There's no stigma about it. The, quest for knowledge in a kind of different way is so interesting and singular here versus like there's just so much in present day. But I don't think I would say I'm like someone who wants to be in that timeframe all the time. There's interesting storytelling there. I'm a huge sci-fi fan, you know?

43:38Jawad MirAre you?

43:39Anya AdamsYeah, like, I was just... Like, I've been like geeking out over Nathan Fillion posting all these things about Firefly returning, which is one of my favorite episode, or shows. And I directed some of The Expanse, which was like by far my favorite sci-fi show of all time. What I like about that show and I like about these shows is that the storytelling and the, not the lessons, but the s… the human experience, can be displayed in a way that people sometimes can absorb easier, easil… easily…

44:21Anya Adams... And take to heart in a different way, and allow them to then maybe... 'Cause I f… I do feel like what we do as storytellers is a little bit of, helping people understand themselves and humanity, and see people for, you know, who they are. And so w… when you can do that in, wrapped in fairy tale like Bridgerton or in, you know, the Gilded Age, like the Gilded Age, I think people, accept that a little bit easier than they do i… in something that's more present day.

44:57Jawad MirYeah.

44:57Anya AdamsIf that makes sense.

44:58Jawad MirYeah, it does. It does. It's, it's... I mean, you look at movies like, Dune…

45:02Anya AdamsYes. Yeah

45:03Jawad Mir... Or Ava… Avatar.

45:04Anya AdamsYeah.

45:05Jawad MirYou know? It plays right in front of us right now in the world. And, yeah, no, I completely get that. So, with that, I'm gonna sort of, I'm gonna ask you some, the really quick question. This is the first time I'm doing this.

45:18Anya AdamsOh.

45:18Jawad MirI've never done this before.

45:19Anya AdamsOkay.

45:19Jawad MirWanted to try something different. Nothing to do with work.

45:21Anya AdamsOkay.

45:21Jawad MirJust very quick questions.

45:23Anya AdamsOkay.

45:23Jawad MirWhat do you think, what do you... To you, what is purpose of life?

45:27Anya AdamsOh, gosh.

45:31Jawad MirIf there was few words to describe it.

45:37Anya AdamsWhat comes to mind is connection.

45:40Jawad MirGreat. What's, w… what's your dream project? Like, what would you want to make one day? It could be a genre. It could be your own film, TV show.

45:52Anya AdamsIt's t… it, a TV show, it would be the best com… like, a great comedy that people just love. Like, it's like, it's like, not... It's like a Friends or for me, the IT Crowd. It's like a warm hug that you can go back to again and again and really enjoy.

46:09Jawad MirGot it.

46:10Anya AdamsYeah.

46:10Jawad MirIs there a specific person, doesn't have to be a celebrity, th… in your industry that you wanna meet, that you look up to?

46:19Anya AdamsOh my gosh. That's a hard one. There's so many names.

46:24Jawad MirLet's, let's, let's come back.

46:26Anya AdamsO…

46:26Jawad MirWhat's your favorite food?

46:28Anya AdamsAnything Asian.

46:30Jawad MirAnything Asian. Say again.

46:31Anya AdamsAnd when I... If it's been like Thai, Japanese, Chinese, I, anything from that, those three.

46:37Jawad MirI'm with you there. If there was a place in the, if there's a place in the world that you wanna travel to the most, where would that be?

46:46Anya AdamsGalapagos Islands.

46:48Jawad MirNice. What makes you happy?

46:51Anya AdamsOh, being around my friends and laughing. Like, just being with my fam. Whe… whether that's family or a friend's family, like just being with my people.

47:03Jawad MirGot it. There was a, there was a, the most recent Harrison Ford, speech that he did, I think it was a lifetime achievement. It was like last week. And he talked about, and it hit me really hard too, that, you know, "I'm, I'm a totally different person," and the, and I'm paraphrasing here, "I'm a totally different person with my own people," meaning the nearest people.

47:25Jawad MirAnd that is such a bang-on thing. Anytime I go to LA, I feel like I'm home. And…

47:29Anya AdamsOh, yeah?

47:30Jawad MirYeah. Oh, yeah. It's like…

47:31Anya AdamsOh

47:31Jawad Mir... It's just such a bizarre feeling. I go very often. I come back, I'm like, "Oh my God, I'm leaving home," even though I'm going to home. Right?

47:39Anya AdamsWow. Wow.

47:39Jawad MirIt's…

47:39Anya AdamsIt's just…

47:39Jawad MirIt, just being in the... I, that would never live in LA, knock on wood. But I'm just saying because of the, you know, everybody's there as they sort of speak your own language, for the lack of a better word.

47:48Anya AdamsYeah. That is true. That's true.

47:52Jawad MirWhat makes you sad?

47:57Anya AdamsPolarization, you know, which is kind of where we are in the world today. This like, inability to understand each other and like, which, you know, makes people make such definitive, like closed-off decisions about people, which I think often then we're, we don't understand each other, and then violence is easier towards each other. Yeah. Yeah.

48:22Jawad MirAnd, it, what makes, what makes you afraid? It could be, it could be a bug, it could be an animal, or it could be just, you know, just, something like polarization.

48:33Anya AdamsYeah, I mean… What makes me afraid right now is, and I'm a victim to it as well, is our like,.. I, it's weird 'cause we have heightened senses, but I also feel like we're kind of dulled in our sentence. Like, we're, we're, we're mesmerized by Instagram, television, all these other things, and disparate, and that makes me worried because I'm... I feel like we need to galvanize to be able to change our world's paradigm, and we just are l… more and more fractured. So I think the fracturing of society. How about that?

49:13Jawad MirFair enough. Going back to the lab for another question. Who do you wanna meet?

49:18Anya AdamsOh, yeah. Oh, gosh. Oh, my mind go…

49:28Jawad MirOr maybe I can re… Who do you wanna direct, if that…

49:31Anya AdamsOh

49:31Jawad Mir... If that helps. Maybe I've made that question much harder.

49:36Anya AdamsYeah, you kind of have. Who do I wanna meet? Like... Oh, God. I'm like, honestly I'm blanking 'cause there's...

49:49Jawad MirAny name that comes to my mind. It doesn't have to be the one exactly that you wanna meet, but, you know, somebody you look up to like Morgan Freeman, I don't know, Al Pacino, Steven Spielberg.

50:00Anya AdamsThose are all so easy.

50:02Jawad MirI know, I know.

50:05Anya AdamsOkay, hold on. You know who I'd like to meet? I'd like to meet Cher. I'd like to meet Cher because I feel like her life, her life trajectory has been so fascinating in who she was and who she is now. I would like to meet her. Yeah.

50:25Jawad MirOkay.

50:25Anya AdamsShe's kind… that's kinda like... It's funny, I don't know. She popped into mind, so how about that?

50:31Jawad MirNo, that's good. That's good. I just wanna sort of, end this now. One of the things we talked about, you said, you know, our work sort of help people empathize, create empathy, not empathize.

50:44Anya AdamsYeah.

50:44Jawad MirEmpathy. And, that is so true because in this day and age, we need that more than ever before, the empathy.

50:54Anya AdamsYeah.

50:54Jawad MirAnd I think, and to your comment about polarization, I think the world is polarized, but I always find if I detach myself from watching social media feeds and try to interact in the real world more…

51:07Anya AdamsYeah

51:07Jawad Mir... The world seems okay.

51:09Anya AdamsYeah.

51:09Jawad MirSo, right? So it's, it's not as bad, but yeah, I can totally see when you're... You know, when we're on swiping, it's like, it's like the world is coming to an end, so

51:19Anya AdamsYeah, I d…

51:19Jawad MirBut the real world is a really beautiful place.

51:21Anya AdamsIt really is, and I... It's actually one of the things, the reasons why I'm really happy to be in New York, and I think Toronto has this too, is like public transportation, so you're always out and around people…

51:31Jawad MirYeah

51:31Anya Adams... And also seeing live entertainment. Like, any live... I've been seeing a lot of, shows in Bro… on Broadway, and the experience of a live performance with an audience, that's something that can't be replicated and is so exciting and also it does, it does, it makes me feel very warm towards humanity when I, when I get to do that.

51:55Jawad MirAwesome. Well, thank you so much, Anya, for your time.

51:58Anya AdamsYeah.

51:58Jawad MirI truly appreciate it. It's been a pleasure talking to you.

52:01Anya AdamsNice to see you.

52:02Jawad MirI hope, I hope you enjoyed the conversation too.

52:04Anya AdamsIt was great. It was great. Thank you.