'Chandu Champion', Cinematographer, Sudeep Chatterjee

0:00Jawad MirLike it's, it's an…

0:00Sudeep ChatterjeeWe were very privileged to actually get to meet a lot of, actual paraplegic, Olympians

0:06Jawad MirOkay

0:06Sudeep Chatterjee... Because a lot of the people that you see in the final championships, a lot of the sportsmen in the Olympic montage and all the swimmers, there are, there are quite a few Olympians playing over there. And it was wonderful to spend time with them and to talk to them and to get to know their stories. It was such a,.. Beyond the film, that was such a, such a, unique experience. I mean, we are so privileged to get to know these people. Yeah, so

0:40Jawad MirHow have you been?

0:42Sudeep ChatterjeeGood. Busy. Because the shoot is quite,.. I mean, it's a single schedule film, the one that I'm doing. Like, it's start to finish, 100 and, I p… no, sorry, what 100 I'm talking about? It's a 35-day shoot, so we finished. Tomorrow's the last day of shoot.

0:59Jawad MirAwesome. Good stuff.

1:00Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

1:00Jawad MirDo you wanna talk about what it is?

1:01Sudeep ChatterjeeI'm, I'm really sorry about the other day. It was quite

1:04Jawad MirNo. It's all good. Do you wanna talk about what film is it, or you're not allowed to talk about it yet?

1:10Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, sure. No, I can. This is a, this is a film from Maddock Films. It's a, it's something that I haven't done before. It's, it's, I would say a family, like part of rom-com, partly comic, s… a very sweet film, and it's got a very talented, bunch of actors. There's Rajkummar Rao, there's Wamiqa Gabbi, there's, Raghubir Yadav, Seema Pahwa, Sanjay Mishra, Vineet Kumar.

1:37Jawad MirOkay.

1:37Sudeep ChatterjeeIt's a lovely cast, and I've, and I've never shot in Banaras, so, getting around…

1:44Jawad MirOne…

1:44Sudeep Chatterjee... Is a little difficult. Like, you know, there's, the traffic is very bad. You... It's better to actually take a boat, rather than, you know, drive.

1:53Jawad MirRight.

1:53Sudeep ChatterjeeThe traffic is pretty bad. And it was really hot. I mean, we were... We shot this film in peak summer, and, like, there were days when it was, like, 48 degrees, and, like, it was really nasty, but a good experience. Good experience.

2:06Jawad MirThat…

2:06Sudeep ChatterjeeI'm, I'm quite happy with the... It's a simple film and, like, all set in real location. Nothing fancy.

2:13Jawad MirWonderful.

2:14Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd I haven't done something like this before, so I had a great time.

2:17Jawad MirThat's really good. Maddock, does work on some great stuff, and it's good to see, good, you know, s… small films coming out and doing well. I was just speaking to Jibin Merchant yesterday, the editor of Laapataa Ladies.

2:29Sudeep ChatterjeeOh, yeah. She's my batchmate.

2:31Jawad MirOh, is she? Okay.

2:33Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, she's my batchmate, yeah.

2:34Jawad MirYeah, so she…

2:35Sudeep ChatterjeeBig girlfriend, actually

2:36Jawad Mir... She, edited Laapataa Ladies, which was a great little film. I really loved it.

2:40Sudeep ChatterjeeOf course. Yeah.

2:41Jawad MirAnd, but it's good to see that kind of stuff coming out. But moving on to Chandoo Champion, I didn't know anything about the story other than the trailer that I saw, right?

2:55Sudeep ChatterjeeOkay.

2:55Jawad MirAnd, going in, I... It... I s… I said this earlier, to somebody as well. It felt like in a g… it's a compliment. It felt like the way the story was structured, because that's the way it actually happened, you know, it's not like that's the way it was written, because he went from one to another. It almost felt like Forrest Gump to me. I don't know if... You know, that whole journey and

3:21Sudeep ChatterjeeOh, okay. Yeah.

3:23Jawad MirIt ju… in a sense that I wasn't sure where was this going, 'cause it kept... You know how sometimes you can tell predictive, like where is this gonna go? Like, after... There was a chapter about, you know, him trying to be a wrestler, then this and then that, and getting to where he wants to be. It was a really well done film. Very well executed, very well shot.

3:44Sudeep ChatterjeeOh, thank you. Thank you.

3:46Jawad MirAnd when I do com… when I do comparison, I'm not doing it in a way of... In a positive way. It's just f… made me feel like I was watching something similar i… in a good way. And Forrest Gump is, you know, obviously one of my favorite films, and it's a wonderful film made. Really well done.

4:05Sudeep ChatterjeeThank you so much. Thank you. That's…... That's so nice to hear.

4:08Jawad MirAnd tell me about, you worked with Kabir Kh… Kabir before.

4:14Sudeep ChatterjeeNo, I haven't, actually.

4:15Jawad MirOh, you haven't?

4:16Sudeep ChatterjeeNo.

4:16Jawad MirOh, no, you haven't.

4:17Sudeep ChatterjeeWe've just…

4:17Jawad MirSo, h…

4:17Sudeep ChatterjeeWe've just been friends and we've, know each other for a very long time. We are,.. Kabir is an excellent photographer, so he's been like a photography friend and, he owns a couple of Leicas and I have, two Leicas, and, like, we have a common, thing about the Leica. We've done, like, photo walks and all that, and been wanting to work together for a long time. Somehow though it was not working, and this time it did, and like…

4:44Jawad MirYeah, that's great

4:44Sudeep Chatterjee... I ju… I actually made sure that it does, because I, like, held everything. I mean, I put everything else on hold to make sure that my schedule matches his.

4:53Jawad MirThat's really good. And it was,.. You know, the, from the standpoint of Kabir being into photography or cinematography, I mean, he was used to be a documentary filmmaker, so he's worked…

5:04Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

5:04Jawad Mir... With cameras a lot. Aside from the fact that you wanted to work with him for a long time, what was the experience like? Not, you know, just in terms of... Because when you know people, it's different than when you work with them in a positive way. What was something that you learned about him that you didn't know?

5:22Sudeep ChatterjeeOf course. See, Kabir has this, Kabir has this, terrific quality of, you know, he's... First of all, he's an extremely chilled out person. Like, absolutely no air about himself. Very easy, not just with me, but with the entire unit. And there's a, there's something wonderful, about him that he makes everybody film feel that, the film is theirs. So you do everything as if it's your own film.

5:49Jawad MirYeah.

5:49Sudeep ChatterjeeBut in a very, beautiful way. Kabir kind of orchestrates the whole thing, and it's, of course, it's his film.

5:58Jawad MirRight

5:58Sudeep Chatterjee... So that's a beautiful… Beautiful way of making movies where, you know, everyone's so involved, everyone's always giving in their 100%. And, yeah. Also, but for me, what was fun was I was working with another photographer, so the collaboration was very interesting, and it was like almost having another bounce board. So I would like I have a habit of talking to myself, while I'm sitting on the monitor and, you know, I sometimes, talk to my chief assistant. But what I talk is mostly kind of talking to myself, just, you know, hearing me out and should I do this? What do you think is a good idea? And like, so here it was Kabir, so I was continuously bouncing, with him, you know? One second. I'm just getting a call, which is why…

6:48Jawad MirNo worries.

6:49Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, no. Yeah. So, it was, so it was that continuous bouncing, you know, just in terms of visual, in terms of you're running through, like normally, you know, the director tells me the shot and I kind of decide what lens to put in and, you know, how to frame it and all. Here it was so collaborative and like, it was so much like I would, like we would discuss over a lens, and it was wonderful to do that. You know, it was wonderful to, you know, share that with a filmmaker who actually knows what that lens will do and what the other one will do. So, I think when you have somebody who's so aware and who's so, photographically conscious, the collaboration always is very good. I mean, I always feel that. I mean, my, that was my experience with K… Shimit as well. Shimit is a very good photographer himself, and so is Kabir. Kabir actually is a fantastic photographer. I really like his photo. His, the work he does, his still photography work. And so it was, it was wonderful to, you know, be able to bounce with somebody of at that level. You know, even for not just framing and lighting, but, you know, not just framing and lensing, but also lighting.

7:53Sudeep ChatterjeeYou know, I'm doing this. We would like, you know, get excited with,.. And equally, I would be equally involved about the performance and, you know, we would, talk. So it was, it was like that. It was just a really lovely process and I had a great time. Great time.

8:08Jawad MirThat's awesome. I was talking to, Rajnish, who, that's how you pronounce his name, right? Rajnish or Rajnish? Okay. So I was sitting in the movie theater, and I had read somewhere that there is a long take sequence. And, when the aerial start, starts and the aerial keeps going, keep going, I'm like, "Oh, they're gonna grab the camera from the aerial, and it's gonna go like, you know, in one take." And that sucked me in so well, not because it was a gimmick, but the way the characters' dialogues and the cameras rotating around them and everything else. So obviously there were some cuts with the, when the explosion happened, like from a creative standpoint. But what a well-executed entire scene. It was so well done from performance from... And making sure, you know, when you're going 360, you have to make sure none of the crew comes in the shot. Like all the…

9:02Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

9:02Jawad Mir... You know, all the extra stuff that's laying around and stuff.

9:05Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

9:05Jawad MirSo tell me some of the challenges as a DP. Was it the first…

9:09Sudeep ChatterjeeVery satisfying experience because that…

9:10Jawad MirOkay

9:11Sudeep Chatterjee... That, just to reach that location was an ordeal because, so we were staying in Pahalgam. So, this plate place, Aru Valley. Aru Valley, the base of it is about, a 40-minute drive from Pahalgam. So, and we wanted to get the first light, the first crack of light. That's what we were attempting because, you know, when the sun rises…

9:33Sudeep Chatterjee... From that, just above the mountain, you get that lovely, backlight, and we would, we shot a lot of it in that light. So which means you need to be rehearsed and ready before, at daybreak, so by the time the sun comes out, by 7:00, 7:30, you get your take. So which means that really early morning you have to get there, and from Aru Valley, from the base where the cars would stop, would be again, it's not, like what? Maybe a 15, 20-minute trek up the mountain, and this is at 9,000 feet. So, initially we would all get like, you know, difficulty in breathing.

10:12Jawad MirYeah.

10:12Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd the climb every morning, and not just us, you know, just heavy equipment and, you know, just getting everything on top of there, getting 300 junior artists. And these are all, you know, people we've got from Jammu and Kashmir, not like trained film junior artists. So to be able to, you know, rehearse them and, you know, instruct them that, you know, this is what you're supposed to do and this is how you're supposed to scatter, this is how, you know, you don't bump into the camera or the moving vehicles and all that. It was a, it was a task, and it was just so satisfying, also because it was, achieved with so much physical hardship. It was like just getting there would be so exhausting. We would like take stops on our way to, you know, get our breath back and like... So, and then you finally pr… produce a scene over there and which is, which kind of turns out really well the way you had imagined, and, very satisfying. Very satisfying.

11:10Jawad MirHow many times you guys rehearsed?

11:12Sudeep ChatterjeeSo we rehearsed, ours was a six-day schedule, and we rehearsed for about, the first three days. First without camera, then with camera. The first, I think, days we were just doing it on our phone. Just, you know…

11:25Jawad MirYeah

11:25Sudeep Chatterjee... Getting the path right, getting the, planning the move, and like, you know, then figuring out, okay, what's possible, what won't happen. So I think, yeah, three days of rehearsal, and then another three days of taking we did.

11:39Jawad MirSo the thing with that whole sequence is you can redo it over and over again if there were especially not that watchtower collapse, right? Like that you can only do, I would imagine, once.

11:48Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. So watchtower collapse, of course, you can't build the set twice, so it had to be…

11:52Jawad MirRight

11:52Sudeep Chatterjee... In one go. Yeah.

11:53Jawad MirSo that moment, do you remember that moment when... You know, when you're, when you're doing something like this, in your head, you're filming, you're making sure the lighting is okay, the f-stop, the focus, and everything, but at the same time you're also thinking about what's coming up next, a scene like watchtower collapsing and how that's gonna unfold. Was it, did it fall as like you guys expected in planning stages?

12:15Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, it did actually. It did.

12:16Jawad MirOkay.

12:16Sudeep ChatterjeeWe were all wondering because, actually that watchtower sequence we were supposed to shoot the day, before, but I felt that by the time we were ready and prepped and all that, we had lost the light. So, I pointed it out to Kabir and I said, "No, let's, let's not. Like, it's a, it's a great sequence, let's not do it." It's like we did it the next day.

12:37Jawad MirHm. Great.

12:38Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, so...

12:40Jawad MirOne of the sequences I'm just trying to imagine the things that come to my mind when I think about the film. There's a couple of s… shots and then one specific scene. Shots being the, on the train, the silhouette with the sunset in the back.

12:55Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

12:55Jawad MirThat was really well done. I'm imagining there was some VFX involved in that, or was that real?

13:01Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

13:01Jawad MirJust…

13:02Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. A little bit.

13:04Jawad MirLittle bit. And…

13:05Sudeep ChatterjeeThe train, the train compartment was an indoor set.

13:08Jawad MirYeah, of course. I mean the outdoor, like when they're on the train, on the, on the roof top.

13:12Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, we had done some plate photography, and, we had some stuff to build it on.

13:17Jawad MirOkay.

13:17Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd we had shot the dancers in a studio in our compartment.

13:22Jawad MirBut it looked very real, I would say that. It didn't, I didn't know... I didn't see it as any VFX.

13:27Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. No, I think Vicki's did a very good job.

13:29Jawad MirYeah. It was really well done. And now also the swimming pool when he's having a flashback, I thought that was really well executed. That was like…

13:37Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, it was. I think it's a beautiful shot

13:37Jawad Mir... It didn't feel tacky. Yeah. It didn't feel cheap and tacky.

13:40Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. The challenge, you know…

13:41Jawad MirIt just looked very good

13:42Sudeep Chatterjee... The challenge was, I'll tell you what the biggest challenge was, that so we had shot this, sequence in the aquatic center in, London.

13:50Jawad MirLondon, right.

13:50Sudeep ChatterjeeThe Olympic pool, the whole sequence. And we had to shoot, the beginning of the, of the, what you, what you can call a dream sequence, where the lighting changes. He's inside water, and the lighting changes from, the regular pool lighting to a warm kind of daylight, you know? So that was, that we couldn't do in, because we couldn't achieve the lighting change in London because, in order for the warm light to kick in, everything else has to become dark. And the, in the London Aquatic Center, there's no way we can make everything dark because that, we didn't have that control. So what we did was we, did that shot in Bombay in a swimming pool.

14:32Sudeep ChatterjeeThe challenge was it was a daylight s… when it was o… an open pool, and we were shooting in the daylight. So we had to, cover the entire swimming pool with the black on the top, create the lighting, create the daylighting matching the, London Aqu… Aquatic Center, and everything was on a fader. And we kind of fade out the Aquatic Center lighting and bring in the warm lighting.

15:01Jawad MirGotcha.

15:01Sudeep ChatterjeeThat was, that actually, it just looks really simple, but that was actually quite a task to achieve because, you know, to achieve…

15:07Jawad MirI'm sure

15:07Sudeep Chatterjee... That on an outdoor pool, first of all, you have to make the, it's a, you know, a big pool to completely make it dark and to create a lighting around it and be able to, you know, so... You know what I'm talking about, right?

15:18Jawad MirI know. I get it. I get it. It's, it's all... That's what cinema is, it's creating magic, right? Like, you're just creating... And sometimes it's the simplest shots that we as an audience experience, "Oh, that's looks nice," but behind it there's a complicated story, right?

15:31Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

15:31Jawad MirLike how you had... I mean, you figure the one take was probably more challenging, which I'm sure it was, but from a lighting standpoint, this was probably more challenging, correct?

15:40Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. Yeah.

15:40Jawad MirYeah.

15:41Sudeep ChatterjeeThis was, this was actually one of the more toughest things to do. Also, we had taken, you know, what you see is his point of view, so we had, taken his point of view, in the, in the London Aquatic Center with…

15:54Sudeep Chatterjee... Through the pool, you see the pool water in the foreground. And what he sees is what we, shot against green. All the visuals of, you know, all his life stories.

16:04Jawad MirRight. Yeah. Of course.

16:05Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd yeah, so that was there. What was interesting is it had a lot of, quite a visual variety, starting in the village. You know, then the, you have the kushti, the wrestling…

16:24Jawad MirYes

16:24Sudeep Chatterjee... Which is, which has a certain, language, and so that's shot in a certain way. And, then what very interesting thing was to, you know, to connect the landscape, of the, where he jumps off the cliff, in the wrestling pit, near the wrestling pit…

16:41Jawad MirRight

16:42Sudeep Chatterjee... And runs over a mountain, gets into a lake, swims over and gets onto the train. Now, these were all, we were... When we were looking for locations, and it was obviously not the same place, we shot over…

16:53Jawad MirYeah

16:53Sudeep Chatterjee... Various locations just to make sure that the geography was right. That was again, I think a challenging thing to, you know, to k… you know, make it look like as if everything was... Because we shot it over multiple locations.

17:07Jawad MirYeah, no, the synergy was 100% there. I couldn't tell that there was a different location in any way. But one thing that you said, which is so true, like ev… there is a... I feel like there, you know, there's five chapters in the book, in the movie, and every chapter has a different look. The army barracks has a different look, right? Like the…

17:24Jawad Mir... The s… the swimming completely different world. The…

17:28Sudeep ChatterjeeThe boxing

17:28Jawad Mir... The wrestling ring, the boxing…

17:30Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

17:30Jawad Mir... The, all that.

17:30Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

17:31Jawad MirAnd that must have been like a, like a, you know, dream come true for you to work on so many different…

17:35Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, absolutely. It was like to get that opportunity in one film to try and get so many looks and, you know, just to make, just to, you know, and just to rack your brain that, you know, how can you make everything look different, you know? Like, I would say that the chapters are there's a village which has a look, then the wrestling, then you have move into the army, then you have the army, sports, the boxing ring, which is again another look.

18:00Jawad MirYeah. Yeah, that was really nice.

18:00Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd then the boxing championship, and then Kashmir, and then the hospital, the rehab center.

18:08Jawad MirYeah. No, it was…

18:08Sudeep ChatterjeeSo

18:08Jawad Mir... It wa… it was all different, but it wasn't, if that makes any sense to you. And I think the reason… ... That was all the same despite being different is because of the script, because of the performances, and everybody just pitching in equally. Like I…

18:22Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, also terrific support from, my production designer

18:26Jawad MirRight

18:27Sudeep Chatterjee... Rajnish…

18:28Jawad MirYeah

18:28Sudeep Chatterjee... And the costume designer, Rohit Chatur. With the, I mean, I think both of them did a fantastic job. And you know, I think, you know, good cinematography happens only when you have a director who wants it, and you have…

18:40Sudeep Chatterjee... A production designer and a costume designer who's, you know, supporting you like that, and, you have a first AD who's kind of making sure that you're getting to shoot at the time that you want to shoot. So here, there's, our first AD Moin, was, like, fantastic. I mean, we couldn't have done this without him. He was so fantastic to make sure that, you know, all the, you know, the wish list that I had that, you know, this scene I want to shoot it in this time. I don't know how he managed to make sure that all happened.

19:13Jawad MirWow, that's amazing. That's... It's really amazing to have a great first AD because it's, you know, you have the captain of the ship, which is the director, and the first in command, which is always the AD, and because he's running the set, or he or she is running the set

19:26Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. It's so important for a DOP. Like, I... The first thing I look out is for is who's the first AD and is he good or not? Because, you know, if he's not doing his job well, it completely, you know, it can affect my work…

19:34Jawad MirYeah

19:34Sudeep Chatterjee... So badly.

19:36Jawad MirYeah. What,.. You know, one of the things that has improved, in this, Indian cinema is the idea of all the departments being in sync. You know, that wasn't probably the case 10, 15, 20 years ago.

19:50Sudeep ChatterjeeTrue. True. True

19:51Jawad Mir... And how... You have obviously sort of seen that evolve, you know, from the mo… from the time that you became interested in cinematography. How do you... Like, do you ima… ever imagine going back to that kind of a world where it's just…

20:06Sudeep ChatterjeeNo

20:06Jawad Mir... You know, you know what I mean, right? It's just like…

20:09Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah

20:09Jawad Mir... Whatever the location is, and just...

20:13Sudeep ChatterjeeNo, yeah. And you have, like, today I think that kind of everybody understands the importance of that. And, you know…

20:19Jawad MirYeah

20:19Sudeep Chatterjee... You create a look book. You cr… you know, you do... Your palettes are decided, and make sure that, you know, every... So everyone's kind of realized that how important is it to, you know, to have a palette and, you know, like, so everything's run through you. I mean, here in this film, I mean, like, not a single junior artist costume, would go without our approval. And

20:40Jawad MirAmazing

20:40Sudeep Chatterjee... Not a single prop would arrive on set without us making sure that, you know, it belonged, in the color family, in the texture family, it was, like, right. So I think people have... Everyone's realized that... What is the advantage of doing that.

20:57Jawad MirNo, it's, it's, it's, it's... It shows. And I s… I said this to Jabeen the oth… the other day, and I spoke to her a few days ago. It... When you're watching a film, and if it's terrible because the story is bad and the performances are bad or whatever, you could tell that the synergy on the set wasn't there. You can see it in the film.

21:15Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

21:15Jawad MirBut when you watch a good film, you can imagine nine out of 10 times everybody was in sync, and that is a testament to everyone's work and obviously the leadership. So it shows in this film, too. It, like, you could tell that people really put their time and effort and passion into it. And, you know, with the story of Ch… Channu-Channu Champion, like, what... Did you know anything about the story before Kabir approached you?

21:38Sudeep ChatterjeeNo. No. I mean, that's a beautiful... No one knew, actually. Kabir had just found out this newspaper article somewhere, and he kind of went and visited him and kind of figured out his story and realized that was a great story to tell. And like, w… in fact, when I, met Kabir for the first time and he told me the story, I said to him, "One second, this is all real? This actually happened to a person, all of this?" And so like,.. Yeah, but look at it, like, n… no one knew about him. But, you know, he had come over to the shoot one day and, like, it was really fascinating to meet him. And, you know, we're shooting with Kartik in the swimming pool training se… sessions, and like it was…

22:19Jawad MirOh, okay

22:19Sudeep Chatterjee... A very emotional moment for all of us to have him.

22:23Jawad MirYeah. And imagine how many stories like these all over the world are not known to people, and cinema…

22:29Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

22:29Jawad Mir... Brings that into…

22:31Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

22:31Jawad Mir... Everyone's perspective, right? Like it's, it's cinema…

22:33Sudeep ChatterjeeWe were very privileged to actually get to meet a lot of, actual paraplegic, Olympians

22:39Jawad MirOkay

22:39Sudeep Chatterjee... Because, a lot of the people that you see in the final championships, a lot of the sportsmen in the Olympic montage and all the swimmers, there are, there are quite a few Olympians playing over there. And it was wonderful to spend time with them and to talk to them and to get to know their stories. It was such a, beyond the film, that was such a, such a, unique experience. I mean, we are so privileged to get to know these people. And like, you know the person he beats in the final, the person he beats in the first match, they're all Olympians.

23:12Jawad MirYeah.

23:12Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd there was this guy who was like, you know, the dark-skinned person who was, who didn't have one leg, and who…

23:19Jawad MirYes. I remember that character. Yeah.

23:21Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. That guy. Yeah. So he's like... And he would do stuff like he would come to set and with one leg he would do, you know, barbell pushups and, like, you know, crazy kind of exercises. And, like, he would inspire all of us to kind of do, pushups and like, you know, like it was fantastic. Just…

23:40Jawad MirThat's amazing. That sounds an experience. Like, that's what's so wonderful about the job, that you get to meet all these…

23:46Sudeep ChatterjeeAbsolutely. Yeah

23:46Jawad Mir... Interesting people. Right? Aside from making a film, but you get to meet all these interesting people. What is one thing on this film or any film just in general, 'cause we know we all go through, there's always difficulties on the set, like, because you're trying to meet certain time, you know, whether it's the lighting situation or costume is not fitting in and the time we're running behind. When you come across something like that, in any, in this case or in any other film, I know it becomes a habit from my own experience that you have just, you just figure out a way over it and you move on, then you try to, you know, come to terms with it. How do you deal with any stress like that comes up on the set, and how do you overcome it? Because it's inevitable. It does come. It's just part of the process.

24:36Sudeep ChatterjeeI mean, like, you are, you know, in the first place, I mean, mentally we are prepared that everything is not gonna go perfect.

24:43Jawad MirRight.

24:43Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd, you know, things will go, wrong. I mean, just, could you just repeat the question a little more, I want to understand…

24:52Jawad MirSure

24:52Sudeep Chatterjee... The question a little better.

24:53Jawad MirSo w… I know that everybody's like, you know, anticipating things are gonna go wrong. Like, that's just the nature of business, right? But sometimes despite us knowing that, something really big comes our way on the set, and it's hard sometimes to tell yourself to kind of calm down, let's assess this. Sometimes a reaction, you know, comes out. It's a very fine balance. I'm just trying to figure out in general, it doesn't even have to be on the film, just in general, how do you deal with any kind of stress that may come about or do you just kind of like move on from it and try not to think about it?

25:28Sudeep ChatterjeeNo, it's, it's, it's difficult to move on. See, because, you know, when you're,.. There are several times what happens on shoot is like, you know, that you're, you're pursuing a certain level of perfection and finish in a shot or, you know, you want everything to be perfect the way you imagined. And maybe you missed it by a bit. Maybe there's some problem or, you know, there's something that didn't happen the way you... You know, it might be so minor that, the next day you might, feel that, "Oh really? I made such a big fuss about that." It is so... But at that moment, at that moment, that's all that you care about. And there, that, you know, that 99.9 and 100% is a huge difference.

26:13Jawad MirYeah. It's, it's true. That's what…

26:15Sudeep ChatterjeeBecause you're, you're in that moment where you're like pursuing that excellence, that, perfection and that finish. That even if you miss it by, even if it doesn't happen by, a milli-fraction it's a big deal. So, you know, that's the nature of the job but at the same time you have to keep the... I mean, I don't think we do it successfully all the time. I mean, I…

26:39Jawad MirYeah

26:39Sudeep Chatterjee... I do get affected very badly if things don't, turn out the way it's supposed to turn out. But I mean, with experience you kind of learn to move on and, look at the picture in a holistic way and, you know

26:55Jawad MirYeah. There's a, there's…

26:56Sudeep ChatterjeeI don't know if it answers the question, but

26:57Jawad MirNo, you did. You did. There's a great story I'll share with you. You've seen Saving Private Ryan, right?

27:03Sudeep ChatterjeeSure. Sure.

27:04Jawad MirYeah. So it was Matt Damon's second film, but Good Will Hunting hadn't come out so he wasn't really a big star at the time. So he was really watching Steven Spielberg direct and when there was a scene, I don't know which scene it was, but Matt Damon gave his performance and, you know, Spielberg said, "Cut." You know, "First take. We're good. Let's move on." So Matt Damon, Matt Damon actually told this story and he said, "Then I went over to Spielberg and I said, 'Don't you think we could do this maybe couple of more times to make it better?'" He goes, "We can s…..." Steven Spielberg goes, "We can spend another two hours making the take from 80% to 85% and waste time or we can move on to other things that are more important." So the g… the whole th… moral of the story from his point was like you'll never get 100%, right? It's always about you think you want it but you just have to move on and sort of... Because there's so many other people who are relying on you know…

27:56Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

27:56Jawad Mir... Your schedule and everything. So it's, it's tough. I know. I am saying this and I know I'll probably the first one to, you know, go under that same stress, but it's just something you move on. It's very, it's very minuscule in the gra… in sort of hindsight, you know, as you said the next few…

28:09Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah, of course, of course. Yeah. Yeah.

28:12Jawad MirWhat's coming up…

28:14Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd you know, I... There are... Like, I'm old school and I don't like finishing it, in post or, you know, adjustment.

28:20Jawad MirYeah.

28:20Sudeep ChatterjeeSo for me, like, the other day it happened that, you know, every... We had a kind of complex single shot that we are trying and at one point of time, the person who was operating the camera, I wasn't operating because there were more than one camera and, you know, I find it difficult to…

28:35Jawad MirRight

28:36Sudeep Chatterjee... If there's a two camera setup I prefer to be at the monitor and kind of talk to the operators rather than do one myself, because the other camera kind of gets neglected. So here it, th… this was this main camera that was going on and at some point, there was a, the operator had messed up the headroom and…

28:53Sudeep Chatterjee... You know, the head got chopped in a, in a way that I didn't want it and, you know, I know I can fix it because I have that much room to, you know, re-adjust the frame. But, you know, you just want a perfect shot. And I was actually quite upset that it didn't happen. And I had to kind of tell myself that, "Hey, like, let it be. I can..." You know, it was something like that.

29:14Jawad MirYeah. No, and it's…

29:16Sudeep ChatterjeeBecause unless you're, unless you're pursuing that perfection, I think, you can't... You have to be mad about it.

29:25Jawad MirYou have to be, and it's also this idea, "We'll fix it in post." it's become much of a more norm now because of all the technology that's available.

29:33Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. Yeah.

29:34Jawad MirBut the thing is, the reality is when you get into that realm of "we'll fix it in post" then everything you'll fix it in post, and the reality is that you may…

29:43Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

29:43Jawad Mir... Not have time afterwards or you may not even have budget afterwards, right?

29:47Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

29:47Jawad MirSo it's, it's not... I don't, I don't think it's old school. I think it's the right thing to... And I think a lot of directors are now coming back to that, like, you know, like they just wanna…

29:56Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah

29:56Jawad Mir... Shoot everything in the camera.

29:56Sudeep ChatterjeeNo, I feel that, you know, sim… something simple like maybe there's a... You know, I'm giving a light to the actor and that light is kind of spilling onto the background. And you know, on DI it's a very simple thing. I can, I can just dodge it very simply on DI, that wall I can take care of. I can otherwise take care of it by putting a flag and dodging the light off. Doing it on set will take a few more minutes to execute and again…

30:21Jawad MirYeah

30:21Sudeep Chatterjee... I can just move on much faster and not worry about it. But you know what? I feel that, the decisions that I'm taking on a live set, you know, looking at actors, it's so organic and it's so,.. There's something about it wh… which, you know, w… weeks or months later when I'm sitting in a dark room, you know, doing my DI, I think my instincts would be more clinical at that point of time.

30:45Jawad MirYeah. Because when you're under pressure in anything in life you tend to make more le… more than less better decisions, 'cause you're coming with your…

30:53Sudeep ChatterjeeAbsolutely

30:54Jawad Mir... Gut and your gut and your instinct, and that's almost… Close to 100%…

30:57Sudeep ChatterjeeThat's true

30:58Jawad Mir... It's almost right. Right?

30:59Sudeep ChatterjeeThat's true.

30:59Jawad MirSo that…

30:59Sudeep ChatterjeeThat's true. Yeah

31:00Jawad Mir... Yeah. In terms of, you know, just to kind of wrap things up, Sudeep, I would love to know, and I know it's a difficult question, when you're working on any film, there's always like, you know, you enjoy every moment of it if, especially in the case of Chandu Champion, if everything sort of works out properly. Do you remember was there one scene where you had the most amount of fun, something that you probably hadn't done before, aside from the long take? I'm not going to talk about that because we already talked about that. That you've, you felt like a kid, and I'm sure you do anyways, you know, like energized and like, "I really... This is really cool. I really wanna do this," or just from a performance standpoint that you enjoyed?

31:47Sudeep ChatterjeeDifficult to... I'm just, I think it's a funny question…

31:48Jawad MirI know, I know

31:49Sudeep Chatterjee... I kind of am asking that, everything was. I mean, like, I don't know, I really had fun doing the train sequence because, you know… ... There was, there was, it was... When we spoke about the sequence and when we knew that, you know, we had to contain it within that one space and, that the choreography is gonna be all inside there and there are gonna be so many dancers and then, you know, the only place to light is through the windows, and, you know, and you have to get a sense of movement through the way you know, you move the lights or whatever you… you're doing. That was great fun in terms of just, the execution. But otherwise, on a, on a personal level, our first schedule was in London, and…

32:33Sudeep Chatterjee... Our second schedule was in, Kashmir. And our third schedule was in, Wai and Pune. So I had been shooting Heeramandi for about more than a year. And Heeramandi was all inside a studio. And, I was dying to get out and be on a…... Real location. So for me, each of those outdoor was just boundless joy. Like, getting up in the morning, you know, m… reaching location by 5:30, 6:00 every day and, you know, feeling the sun and like, you know, breathing fresh air and all, it was just so... It was like, I kept thanking Kabir for that, you know, I've been stuck inside a studio for such a long time. And…

33:17Jawad MirYeah

33:17Sudeep Chatterjee... Though that was great fun. I mean, like, that, the f… the, what we were doing on Heeramandi and Gangu Bhai is like to control the lighting completely and kind of, you know, m… get the 7:00 be like 7:00 sun, you know.

33:34Jawad MirYeah.

33:34Sudeep ChatterjeeThat was great fun. But this was something else, and I really... That was, when I look back on Chandu Champion and shooting the movie, that was the best thing, that, you know, we had such fantastic outdoor schedules.

33:45Jawad MirWhat a great way to transition from indoor sets to so many different locations and so many different palettes, like complete opposite worlds.

33:53Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

33:53Jawad MirYeah.

33:53Sudeep ChatterjeeWas very lucky to get a project like this.

33:57Jawad MirAmazing. What's, what's next up for you that you're gonna work on? Are you taking a break?

34:02Sudeep ChatterjeeSo after I finish this, I'm, it's a little, too early to talk about it, but I'm… ... In very advanced talks, for the next one. That's a big, that's a big f… film. It's a... I mean, like, it's a, it's a very large scale film.

34:17Jawad MirAwesome.

34:17Sudeep ChatterjeeAnd, it's

34:19Jawad MirThat's awesome

34:20Sudeep Chatterjee... Just that I'm not allowed to talk about it because the…

34:22Jawad MirNo, it's okay. It's okay

34:22Sudeep Chatterjee... Film is not even announced. But it's a v… it's something that I'm, I'm very excited about. It's a genre that I've not done before, and yeah, so…

34:33Jawad MirThat's amazing

34:33Sudeep Chatterjee... I mean, there's a lot on my mind about that, but we'll talk about it…

34:36Jawad MirWell, I'm looking... Absolutely, we would, I would love to. I'm looking forward to that. In this hectic schedule, how does it work with your family? You're always on the road.

34:45Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. That's, that's something that…... Yeah, that's

34:51Jawad MirHard

34:51Sudeep Chatterjee... Something that kind of takes up,.. And now, you know, the kids have grown up.

34:58Jawad MirGrown up.

34:58Sudeep ChatterjeeMy son is an assistant director. He worked on Chandu Champion.

35:03Jawad MirOh, good. Oh, awesome. Good stuff.

35:04Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. He'd just finished college, and he wanted to, be on set, and like, he, and he came with me to Kashmir, and then, Kabir said that, "Okay, but if you want to be a director, then what are you doing with your dad? You must come and assist me." So from the Kashmir…... Schedule onwards he started working with Kabir, and, he assisted. We had a great time. So it was wonderful working with my son also. Like, for the first time we did something together. And, like, he had to call sir, me sir on set, and like, he was staying in a different hotel with the... All that was great fun. So…

35:37Jawad MirThat's really good. That's really good.

35:39Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. So my daughter's,.. She works for the UN. She's posted in Jordan.

35:45Jawad MirAmazing

35:45Sudeep Chatterjee... She's, wo… works as a protection officer for the, Palestine refugees. And…

35:51Jawad MirI was…

35:52Sudeep ChatterjeeSo she's there…

35:52Jawad Mir... I was gonna say it's a tough place to be at right now.

35:55Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah. But she's very committed. She's... She has a lot... She finds a lot of purpose in what she's doing.

36:02Jawad MirI would love to talk to her one day because I'm actually... I mean, aside from, this podcast is sort of transforming into a lot of other, you know, just stories in general, but I'm actually working on a film, in pre-production stage about the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. And

36:19Sudeep ChatterjeeOh, yeah. I mean, you'd, you'd, you'd love talking to her. She's, she's very informed, and she's very committed to what she's doing. And, like, she, did her, master's from Oxford. She studied refugee and forced migration. And she kind of chose to... She said, you know, "This is a field that needs a lot of work, and I feel that I, my life..." this cause. And she, like, she was, I mean, very lucky to get the job. She applied, and she got the job, and then she's there.

36:51Jawad MirThat's amazing.

36:51Sudeep ChatterjeeYeah.

36:51Jawad MirYeah, I would lo… I would love to talk to her. And, I mean…

36:54Sudeep ChatterjeeSure

36:54Jawad Mir... We're actually, we're actually... It's funny you mentioned Jordan, because we've been exploring, locations for the film, and one of the locations that we have in mind, or at least the country that we have in mind, is Jordan, so…

37:06Sudeep ChatterjeeIt's spectacular

37:06Jawad Mir... I don't know if that how that would go…

37:08Sudeep ChatterjeeIt's spec... I was there in February. It was spectacular. I've, I've to… I mean, saw quite a bit. We drove around, Petra and, you know, Wadi Rum and…

37:21Jawad MirNice

37:21Sudeep Chatterjee... They're just, like, outstanding. And it's beautiful country. Beautiful people. Really wonderful people.

37:28Jawad MirYeah

37:29Sudeep Chatterjee... Very friendly.

37:31Jawad MirAwesome. Thank you so much, Sudeep, as always. Pleasure talking to you.

37:34Sudeep ChatterjeeSame here. Same here.

37:34Jawad MirI can't wait to talk to you about future projects. It's always a pleasure.

37:38Sudeep ChatterjeeYes. Absolutely.

37:40Jawad MirThank you so much for giving time. Appreciate it.

37:42Sudeep ChatterjeeMy pleasure. My pleasure. Thank you.

37:44Jawad MirAll right. Take care. Bye-bye.

37:45Sudeep ChatterjeeBye.