'Fall 2: Deadpoint', Cinematographer, Andrew Strahorn

0:00Jawad MirThe arc of the protagonist… ... That how she, you know, went from being completely, like, you know, afraid, her entire trajectory, and even how the film sort of wraps up, I really dug that part, and that rarely happens in a film like this.

0:14Andrew StrahornOh, yeah, that was,.. You know, for Peter and Mike, it's always comes down to them as directors. It's always about characters for them. And we all discuss this and there's no point having characters you don't care about. Ironically, that it… it's the first time I've actually thought about this, that you brought this up, is that Harriet and, Simu, they almost mimic that in off camera because there was some trepidation, you know, just natural trepidation of, "Okay, we're gonna go do this movie, but we… what are we actually getting ourselves into?" And it was a very physically demanding movie for the cast. I think by the end, there was a certain mental and physical toughness just as a, as individuals, as people.

1:07Jawad MirI knew about the film Fall, the very first that came out, I think it was three years ago. And, but I had never had a chance to see it. So yesterday, before I went to see the second one, literally right before that, I saw the first one at home.

1:22Jawad MirSo it was like a double matinee movie kind of a thing. And, you know, I was very surprised by the first one. I wasn't, like I had no expectations and whatnot. And the second one, without getting into it too much, I felt, which is the one that you worked on, I, as I was watching them, I s… saw a lot of, you know, repetitions from the first one, like some certain things that were happening. But I'm like, okay, I s… I started thinking to myself, "Okay, I know what's gonna happen. I know it's..." But then the film just went in a completely different direction, right?

1:55Andrew StrahornOh, lovely.

1:55Jawad MirSo I was, that was, that was really surprising to see. And it was really cool to see both of them from a height perspective because the point of view shots that you guys did… ... Was really phenomenal because it really puts the audience…

2:10Andrew StrahornYeah

2:10Jawad Mir... Right in that space.

2:12Andrew StrahornYeah. Yeah. Peter and Mike were, you know, it was definitely, it was definitely important the directors, the twin directors for us, to always feel like wherever we are, there's trepidation. And obviously, to a larger extent, the way we executed the film, the actors were not close to the ground. Let's just say that. And so there was always just, you know, they were always minimum 20 to 25 feet, and then upwards to 40 feet, always off the ground. So it was an interesting, it was an interesting approach to shooting a movie that, was, you know, 80% in the air. And, you know, so that was a really, fun challenge that Peter and Michael and I, you know...

3:18Andrew StrahornIt was almost resetting how you would do things as opposed to being on the ground.

3:24Jawad MirYeah. And obviously, you know, there was a lot of studio stuff, but it seemed… ... At least from what I saw, you know, a lot of on location stuff. So, you know, talk to me about... So obviously, you know, there's the shots of, you know, them kinda going in the first, in the beginning and somewhat towards the end. But the shots which were sort of like establishing shots where you see like, you know, people walking on planks and the actual location, were there any point, any stunt people that were actually doing this, or was it more sort of a post-production thing? If that's something…

4:02Andrew StrahornI

4:02Jawad Mir... You wanna talk

4:04Andrew StrahornYeah, I think that there was a blend of that. Obviously, there was some dangerous stuff that was, where the principal cast were very down to being there as much as possible and to be, to giving it a go. But then there was, there was, you know, a couple shots where it was just, for logistics reasons, it was just better to do with stunts, doubles. But they, to their credit, they were there for a hell of a lot of it, if not the majority. And so from that perspective, it was, it was a blend, but it wasn't as much as you thought. There was, you know, it was definitely always live action photography taking place throughout all of the wide vistas and so forth. It was sometimes just scaling back even further than where we, where we were.

5:10Andrew StrahornBut, there was definitely, a live action component to 100% of anything to do with the characters, for sure. You know?

5:24Jawad MirThat's awesome.

5:25Andrew StrahornSo yeah.

5:27Jawad MirIn terms of, you know, cinematography… ... What was… We kind of touched upon it right now, just the audience being physically involved into the immersive experience of dealing with heights. What was the process of you sort of working on this film in terms of, you know, lighting? Because especially with, especially at night sequences outdoors, even if it's a set, you just gotta be very careful because you don't wanna overdo it or underdo it, right? So talk to me about lighting, the process, and what was the beginning of all this and how you sort of went through it with your directors.

6:05Andrew StrahornWell, I think that we knew that, The path that as the characters start, whether it be in and around Bangkok to the bar to then the initial scaling and then getting onto the mountain itself, we definitely understood that there's and the approach that I have on that is that you've got to allow the characters and the performers to explore the environments and because in that get that I feel always gives a better sense of naturalism to whatever you're shooting. So but when we say, for instance, when we're on the mountain as we start scaling the rest of it, a lot of that was where we were and where we were photographing, the vantage point of the curvature of where the sun always was always it was literally right to left or left to right.

7:12Andrew StrahornWe were always in the face of the sun. So that being said, the camera the sun's behind the camera's back depending on your angle. So the approach that knowing full well that as they're scaling up and they're going around the mountain, you know, because of the nature of the size of the rock or the mountain to relationship to where the characters and how small they were, we would generally speaking, we would utilize massive diffusions. And so we would use what they call, you know, obviously in North America, fly swatters.

7:55Andrew StrahornAnd then they'd have beards on them, so they're 20 by 20s with another 20 by 20. So you put three of them together, now you have 60 by 40. So now you can change, the diffusion from whether it be a solid black to a single net, which still allows hard light, to a soft diffuser, to a heavy diffuser. So I constantly tried to change up the quality of light to give it as if you're passing through these elements. So for the most part, it tries to give it, whether it be raining or what have you, or sunny or late afternoon, it gives it, some sort of time of day dynamic to it that re… you know, reflects the time of where they are and the danger. So that was generally the approach in, with all of the, daylights, dusk, dawn, approach was manipulating the sun for where it was.

9:01Andrew StrahornJust because in order to get the cameras up near within the space of where the actors were, you… you're looking at a, you know, you're looking at 40, 50 feet away.

9:13Jawad MirYeah.

9:13Andrew StrahornSo everything is a much bigger circle manipulating around them to now let them play within that environment. So it gave the directors the ability, the entire movie was storyboarded, which was great because the benefits of storyboards is it gives you a sense of time.

9:34Jawad MirYeah.

9:35Andrew StrahornYou can, you can always do that on the day, but the logistics of working hand-in-hand with the tight crew was to physically get the actors costumed, then up there strapped in safety-wise from a stunt performing point of view, and then to act. You're looking at losing probably 30, 40% of your actual shooting time. So once they're up there, like it was important photographically, but also, you know, to give the canvas as big as they could, as I could to the actors and the directors so they could play within that space.

10:14Andrew StrahornAnd it would allow setup time from a wide shot to a close-up to be very quick. So that was, I thought, was an important element to give…

10:28Jawad MirVery quick you mean.

10:31Andrew StrahornOh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because it was, it… and they're in, they're in it, you know, the actors are in the moment at the time, and I think that's important to the more you can keep the actors in it, the better off you are for overall for the film. So that was,.. And that's just the approach maybe having learned come from Australia, you know, like, the directors are Australian. I live in Los Angeles and have for the last 21 years, but we, you know, being Australian, it was always, an a… an approach of, efficiency within the execution, you know?

11:13Andrew StrahornAnd, just because we all started together and, you know, you're limited on equipment, so you have to think very resourcefully how do you go about things, planning things for time of day, but then manipulating the light and how can you use that for your advantage, you know?

11:33Jawad MirRight.

11:34Andrew StrahornSo…

11:35Jawad MirYeah, no, that makes sense. That makes sense. It's, I kind of guessed either you're from New Zea… New Zealand or Australia, which is, you know, a pool of talent of talented people come from Australia, especially in Hollywood. And, I've had the pleasure of having several times, I'm sure you know of him, John Seale.

11:53Andrew StrahornOh, great guy. Great cameraman.

11:55Jawad MirYeah. Yeah.

11:55Andrew StrahornI mean, he's, he's part of that, you know, that wave of, you know, Don McAlpine, Dean Semler, Russell Boyd, Peter James, you know, just extraordinary cameramen that were part of that wave that really busted into Hollywood in the '80s and, then established themselves from that point on and… It is, it is… I always still think to this day, mate, that, whenever you're in a bind, I go, "What would I do if I was in Australia?" And it serves me pretty well because it keeps you grounded in the sense of, yes, there's, there's a, you know, particularly being in North America, there's a tool, that is probably available or, that has been designed to do something in particular. But, you know, for whatever reason, location-based or financially, you might not be able to have that tool. What would you do to recreate that?

12:55Andrew StrahornAnd…

12:56Jawad MirRight

12:56Andrew Strahorn... You know, I feel very lucky that I learned a lot of my beginnings, in the, in the fundamentals back home in Australia. And it taught you to do a lot with a little.

13:12Jawad MirYes.

13:12Andrew StrahornAnd it taught, it taught you to not be afraid of the sun, in the sense that, you know, I find, over, you know, my time here, everyone's always wanting to diffuse the light and to do things, to glamorize it, if you will, ugly light. And, you know, when I was starting to shoot in the '90s, late '90s to early 2000s in Australia, we just didn't have that available. So it was always about balancing whatever is the sunlight doing and whatever is the look of the tone, balancing those midtones and shadows to wherever you need them to be for that look. And so it was a different approach. I always think differently when it comes to sunlight and shooting people…

14:04Jawad MirRight

14:04Andrew Strahorn... Outside and the rest of it because it's, I feel, you know, I feel like I was lucky to learn in Australia where the light was very much harsher than, say, North America or, you know,.. But the light in Thailand was, w… had this, there was a beauty to it, which was really quite amazing. And, even the direct light was, there was a soft beauty to it that I noticed that a lot. But, yeah, it's, it's, you know, and I think that's a, I think that's an important element sometimes too, that you don't, it's hard not to wanting to beautify stuff, but you want things to be realistic.

14:50Jawad MirI agree.

14:50Andrew StrahornYou know, particularly when you have two young ladies and who are main cast members, and you want to photograph appropriately that it doesn't become detracting, but they still feel, they still look somewhat dignified for their character in that moment.

15:13Jawad MirNo, I agree. I agree wholeheartedly. And, you know, I was reading, before this film was green-lited or at the time this film was green-lited, part three was also green-lited simultaneously.

15:27Andrew StrahornIt was, yeah.

15:28Jawad MirAnd I think, I'm, I'm terrible with the names, but the third one has the same writer-director as the first one does.

15:36Andrew StrahornYes.

15:37Jawad MirAnd I, and the way this film sort of wraps up, I wasn't really expecting it to go in that direction, and I still wasn't sure how it kind of ended and what it's suggesting, although, I mean, I have a hint. Are you in any way, w… when you're working on the second, was the third one being kept in mind in terms of writing and, 'cause it was green-lited simultaneously, right? So I'm assuming it was being sort of worked on at the same time at different stages.

16:05Andrew StrahornI think, I think the production company, and, the EP, original writer, EP/original writer, and, director, Scott Mann, he alr… he already had an idea, for that. And so, my part of this universe was just coming in to do our part for number two and carry on the torch, so to speak. So, I know the, l… you know, some very broad brush strokes of what, number three may entail, but n… nothing more detailed than that. But it was, we tried to approach this that other than the Easter egg, that the film finishes with, we tried to just play it as a standalone, that this is a new environment, this is a new look.

17:08Andrew StrahornAnd so what was achieved on the, on the first one was outstanding and a, and a success. And so this was trying to, f… typically from a visual standpoint, was to trying to embrace a different, s… sense of threat in a way that didn't feel photographically that, we were watching, part two as much as it was this is a standalone visually, and then whatever happens in three. So hopefully there's, you know, three different worlds, so to speak, you know. But, you know, I think that's important.

17:50Jawad MirAnd that, and that certainly showed up. I mean, I did feel very... 'Cause, you know, you have, you had a lot of sort of orange-ish tones in the first one just because obviously the desert, the desert surrounding, and this was more, like, blue.

18:04Andrew StrahornYes.

18:04Jawad MirYou know, kind of like the cold…

18:06Andrew StrahornYes

18:06Jawad Mir... The heat versus cold. And, I was just wondering, I know some of it was on stage, some of it was on location. W… where do you stand in terms of dealing with heights?

18:22Andrew StrahornI, d… I'm not a fan myself. I'm not,.. You know, it's, it's a weird primal thing. I just never liked heights from an early age, and I still not a, not terribly, fussed with it. But, I, you know, I definitely feel, like I'm glad someone else is doing it, you know? But it was, again, it was, it was, I think that everyone's own internal viewpoint on heights and how does that make you feel uncomfortable or queasy or what have you. I think, between the directors and myself and the production designer, Jacinta Lyon, it was definitely a conversation that was always at the forefront of our decision-making of how do we always make it feel like there is a sense of beauty but danger to th… this, th… this setting, so to speak.

19:28Andrew StrahornYou know?

19:29Jawad MirYeah.

19:30Andrew StrahornSo.

19:30Jawad MirAnd I really love the message in the first film as well as in this. And in the first one, it wasn't that obvious, and that doesn't mean in any way, like in a, in a negative way. But in this one, what I really love, without giving it away, the arc of the protagonist.

19:47Jawad MirThe how she, you know, went from being completely like, you know, afraid, and she does this one little bit where she has to get something, if you know what I'm referring to. And after that, her entire trajectory and even how the film sort of wraps up, you know, kind of reminded me of the film, Cliffhanger. I don't know if you remember that from, it was just a moment.

20:10Jawad MirAnd, h… how she d… how she sort of overcame that. I really, I really dug that part, and that rarely happens in a film like this. It rarely does because some, you know, it's more about the action and the entertainment and all that, and I really felt strongly about that. I thought it was really well done.

20:29Andrew StrahornOh, yeah. That was,.. You know, for Pete and Mike, Spierig, it's, it's, it's, it's always comes down to them as directors. And they've done a lot of visual world building in their previous movies, but it's always about characters for them. So they wanted, and we all discussed this, and there's no point having characters you don't care about. If you don't care about them, then we really don't care what happens…

20:54Jawad MirExactly

20:56Andrew Strahorn... At whatever junction. So it was, and I think to some degree too, ironically, that it's the first time I've actually thought about this, that you brought this up, is that, you know, I think for, you know, Harriet and Nasima, I think they almost mimic that in off camera because there was some trepidation where, you know, just natural trepidation of, "Okay, we're gonna go do this movie, but we, what are we actually getting ourselves into?" And it was a very physically demanding movie for the cast, the three cast members being in relentless weather for 30 odd days. And so I think by the end, there was a certain mental and physical toughness just as a, as individuals, as people that they had, definitely, demonstrated, from their time shooting the movie, you know, and being in those elements and being, you know,..

22:08Andrew StrahornBecause really there's no protection up there, and when we'd hit them with rain or what have you know, it was just, it was, it was, they were definitely in very uncomfortable situations for a very long time. And so it was interesting to see what mimicked on the, what was the script. I think the actors walked away with that, you know, post, shooting as well. You know? And you know, I think it, you know, it was, it was nice that those transitions from overcoming your fears to the end of the movie, you know, photographically that, you know, one thing I appreciate about Peter and Michael Spierig was that they're very self-aware about light. They're very aware of the truth that light, you know, perceives within a film. So they were very encouraging and embracing, we need to shoot this at backlight.

23:09Andrew StrahornWe need to shoot this at this time of day. ... So when we're at the end with the lockers and things like that, they were very, supportive, of we need to be shooting this at this time of day and let's really heavily manipulate everything else, you know, in order to protect that. And then I think that gives it that kind of not sun setting in… in… into the, you know, in, you know, into the end of the movie, but it just, that type of quality of light is, very much, I think heroically reflected where that character had gone and had come out in the other end. You know? So, you know, that was, yeah, that was a lot of fun to shoot, and particularly the stuff at the end with the bar and…

24:05Jawad MirSure

24:06Andrew Strahorn... You know. What's interesting is the film, I don't know if there's ever gonna be a di… a director's cut or extended version. There's, there's, a… as with any film, you photograph the script and then whatever makes it to screen is… You know, is the decision of the filmmakers, the studio, the production company and Tom Cruise. And it's interesting that you picked up on certain attributes and tonal storylines of the characters because, there was a lot of that photographed in the beginning.

24:39Andrew StrahornSo there, it, you know, whether or not the studio or the production company or Scott ever wants to expand on that, you know, there's definitely more of that world that is out there that we photograph that just plays a lot, a lot more deeper into those, moments, so to speak, and…

25:04Jawad MirThat's awesome. And I think while we're talking about the art, the best thing, and, that's more of a camera thing and obviously in the script… ... The way the transformation of the character was shown in the beginning and the end was a scene when she enters in the bar and the lady who's playing pool.

25:24Andrew StrahornYeah.

25:24Jawad MirAnd then in the end when she walks in and how the reaction of her is. I thought that was really spectacularly done. Like, and it just showed what the character went through, and the woman recognized that and she respected that. That…

25:38Andrew StrahornYeah

25:38Jawad Mir... That was phenomenal.

25:40Andrew StrahornYeah. Yeah. When we, when we started that, you know, we were lucky enough, we, you know, we had a great production facilitating company in Thailand… ... Very lucky there, which brought really talented technicians, you know, to the production. So essentially it was myself, Michael, and Peter Spirig, and Jacinta Lyon as the designer, but they were es… essentially it, other than I was, allowed to bring my key grip from the United States, Craig Laura, Riley Jr., and his son, Craig Riley. So, sorry, Craig Riley and then his son Craig Riley Jr. So we were very much entrenched into their culture, into their way of filmmaking, into their way of approaching, shooting, which is always interesting when you have a language barrier.

26:42Andrew StrahornBut we had a number of really talented people that could communicate and translate what we would like to the talented crew. So knowing that just takes time. You know, when you're on a U… you know, when you're on an LA schedule, so to speak, even though you're in a foreign land, you're on an LA schedule. And so, you know, a lot of that, what I like to do a lot is, from my previous work, is to light the environment in a way that allows, again, the actors to play within that space. So it gives it a little bit more of a freedom to wherever they wanna go. And so rather than this is the pizza slice, you have to walk here to here. And so a lot of that bar sequence that you see in the first part of the film where at night, you know, it was very much, a large lighting setup that allowed us 80% of the framework was done.

27:52Andrew StrahornSo it allows the actors to stay in and it allows there to be a lot of coverage if needed.

27:58Jawad MirSure.

27:59Andrew StrahornYou get those little idiosyncrasies between characters and the, you know, between storyline and whatnot. So, and then to flip that at the end where it was, you know, at sunset was, it's just nice to see that. I mean, and Jacinta Lyon built that, and it was such a cool set. I wish we could have had a wrap party there, to be honest, because it was so much fun, but it didn't exist. She just, we found where we w… wanted to go with the water, and we just, and she did, and her team, Thai team, did this amazing job of building this, functional bar that just had so much energy and vibrance to it. So as soon as I saw it was like, oh yeah, we're just adding to what you've done.

28:46Jawad MirThat's amazing. That's amazing. What was perhaps the most challenging part in this film, whether it was from a technical standpoint or psychological or emotional…

28:59Andrew StrahornI think

28:59Jawad Mir... For you as DP?

29:04Andrew StrahornI think, mate, it was, I think in general it was, it was really the mountain one because we, anytime we wanna do anything on the ground or whatever, you can easily just physically move something and walk over there and do that. So everything was almost from the director's perspective and my perspective, it was almost reframing and rethinking how do we approach this from even the simplest shot. So I think that was probably the most challenging, was now thinking that the camera is in the air, and where do you go from there? And how do you move? Because there's obviously a delay. We were on cranes, you know…

30:00Andrew Strahorn... Large cranes, fixed arm. Moving or swinging the arm, there's a delay because of weight, inertia, and the whole thing. So it was, it was balancing and taking those into account with regards to, in real time, what we needed based on the boards. So that was, that was sometimes a lot of math… I generally like mathematics. I did it through anyway. So I'm sometimes working out because we use, GF cranes that are fixed arms on…

30:35Jawad MirRight

30:36Andrew Strahorn... 80 to 100 feet of dolly track. So what that allows us to do is to move 80 feet along with an arm. Well, at some point you're gonna get, you know, an arc based off where the fixed point is on the crane. So it was working out what worked to create these shots without bringing attention to a technical inadequacy.

31:04Jawad MirRight.

31:04Andrew StrahornSo sometimes that was interesting, really trying to work out going, "Okay, if we're here, I need to put this... Okay, let's change it and put it there." And, you know, it's all hunch work, obviously. But, we got the hang of it pretty quickly once we started. Yeah.

31:21Jawad MirYeah. And it must be challenging, right? Because after, especially, the, I mean, this is in the trailer so I can, I can talk about it, like, you know, when they're stuck on the planks, there's so many angles you can actually shoot that at. It becomes mundane, right? Like, you know, you can do, like, a two-shot…

31:37Andrew StrahornYes

31:37Jawad Mir... A single shot, a low angle shot, a high angle, a distant. But it d… because their backdrop is the mountain…

31:45Andrew StrahornYes

31:45Jawad Mir... It doesn't really change anything.

31:47Andrew StrahornYes.

31:47Jawad MirSo that becomes a little challenging, as you said.

31:51Andrew StrahornYeah. It was always trying to find, obviously, y… you know, the right angle for that. You know, e… every scene is a piece of a puzzle, of a great puzzle, which is the film. It was always interesting trying to find the right camera position for that scene without trying to be repetitive, but also…

32:12Jawad MirYeah

32:12Andrew Strahorn... Not giving away shots that you had in your back pocket for the scenes following.

32:18Jawad MirRight.

32:18Andrew StrahornSo that was always an interesting, you know, a… always an interesting approach that we had. But also, too, you're always trying to be in a position where hopefully if the, if the characters are engaging and they're feeling, you know, that's their playground up there, then hopefully that will… it becomes less about, you know, the camera being noticeable and more about the tone and the performance within that moment, so to speak.

33:00Jawad MirRight.

33:00Andrew StrahornI mean, that was the aim anyway. And, I hope we achieved that. But it was definitely, it's always a challenge when you really got a one-set, really. That's what you have. You know?

33:15Jawad MirYeah.

33:15Andrew StrahornSo you're always trying to choose which angle will tell the story better…

33:20Jawad MirOf course

33:20Andrew Strahorn... With performances and depth and all of that.

33:25Jawad MirYeah. No, that's, that's, that's awesome, man. I felt a lot of times… I think for me as an audience member, the only thing that became challenging to grasp was w… the part that I was talking about, where it became a little mundane because, again, that's where they're stuck at.

33:42Andrew StrahornYeah.

33:42Jawad MirBut other than that, I think that was, like, five, 10 minutes where I felt that. But other than that, it was just, I couldn't even believe that the movie was over that quickly. Like, even though it's an hour and 45 minutes long…

33:52Andrew StrahornYeah

33:52Jawad Mir... I think that's the duration.

33:53Andrew StrahornYeah.

33:54Jawad MirIt goes by really fast. And the beats are really there and the pacing is really well done. And I would love to see the director's cut whenever that… if that ever makes it to the public's eye, 'cause that's always fun to see, like, you know. At the time you will think that, "Oh, there's something missing," but once you become accustomed to a film, then if you watch it after a while, like, oh, that wasn't really needed, you know.

34:21Andrew StrahornYeah.

34:21Jawad MirI'm happy with this.

34:23Andrew StrahornYeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's one of those things that it's gr… it was great that we… again, the s… the script that Scott and John O. Wrote, as all that was photographed, obviously, you know, I think Fincher famously said that there was, there's always three movies made. There's one in pre-production, one in the shoot, and post. And, you know, it was great that we had it, so it'd be better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

34:53Jawad MirYeah. Absolutely.

34:55Andrew StrahornSo it was, you know, it's nice to know that we had that should they want to expand in act one or act two, act three, they had those options. And ultimately, you know, what became of the release and whatnot is, they felt is the, is the right path for the story of these two characters and what may continue thereafter.

35:26Jawad MirYeah.

35:27Andrew StrahornSo…

35:27Jawad MirAnd I really, I really enjoyed that, right? Like, so it's… even though it's a standalone film in a way, it still has its legs to the previous one and to the upcoming one. And that just, again, connects you with the characters and now you're like, "Okay, I wanna know what happens with these two characters."

35:44Andrew StrahornYeah.

35:44Jawad MirYou know, it's not really necessarily about the location and the fall, which…

35:47Andrew StrahornYeah

35:47Jawad Mir... We know it's gonna be, you know, in a similar type of a setup, because the title Fall.

35:54Andrew StrahornYes.

35:54Jawad MirBut just the, but just the where is this going now?

35:58Andrew StrahornYeah.

35:58Jawad MirWhat is the relationship between these two characters that's gonna unfold?

36:02Andrew StrahornYeah. I'm as curious as you. I mean, I, like I said, I only know the log line, like a sentence, but, Scott has a plan. He definitely has a plan. And, I'm sure that, much like the first one, it'll, it'll continue on universe as to what happens with these, really, these characters and, The tre… trepidation that you have in these environments, you know, that, you know, it's, it's a great concept really. As simple as it is, it's a…

36:39Jawad MirIt's a complicated one at the same time

36:41Andrew Strahorn... We all have that primal fear. We all, for the most part, we all have that primal fear of…

36:44Jawad MirYeah

36:44Andrew Strahorn... Heights and so forth. And, you know, and I think he's, he's tapped into something of the human condition that really is, the stories that haven't really been, put out there too much. So it was, yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely exciting that they went from a tower to a mountain, you know, and wherever they go next is, I think it's, I think it's very clever that, the initial concept and then they thought of a mountain, so to speak. So

37:23Jawad MirWell, in the, in the picture, a… and the end of the film, there's a, when she's looking through the booklet…

37:30Andrew StrahornYes

37:31Jawad Mir... They kind of show something which I don't wanna say, but that would be interesting because there was an incident that happened in Pakistan. There's a movie out on it now. It's called Hanging By The Wire.

37:45Jawad MirI don't know if you've heard of it.

37:46Andrew StrahornNo, I ha… I haven't. No.

37:47Jawad MirActually, I would recommend that you watch it. It's a, it's a document…

37:50Andrew StrahornOkay

37:50Jawad Mir... It's a documentary. It's 74 minutes long. So these guys, and I know the, I know the director through one of my colleagues who she worked with, and there's a remote village in the northern part of Pakistan where these kids would go to school using a cable car.

38:07Andrew StrahornOh.

38:07Jawad MirAnd this cable car snaps, and it's hanging with, like, eight people inside.

38:13Andrew StrahornWow.

38:13Jawad MirAnd the wh… the whole film is around that, like how does the news sort of travel to the national, you know… ... Broadcasting and the rescue team and all that, and it's really well done. Actually, it was so good that Universal actually came halfway through the film and decided to back it up and fund it and

38:33Andrew StrahornOh, wow. That's great

38:34Jawad Mir... So I highly recommend it. And it's, it deals with heights, of course, but it deals with more of, like, the whole, the community and the human condition…

38:42Andrew StrahornYeah

38:42Jawad Mir... And all that. Yeah.

38:43Andrew StrahornYeah. I think it's, you know, ul… ultimately, I think, you know, movies like this, they, it's, it's, it really deals, you know, interestingly with the human spirit of when, you know, when put to task and you're in a position that might feel challenging or hopeless, what happens and…

39:03Jawad MirYeah

39:04Andrew Strahorn... You know? And I think, I think there's a, there's hundreds of thousands if not millions of e… examples throughout human history where, much to what you were just discussing, it, on its surface, to say that out loud, that it's like, wow, how do you even get there? How do you even approach a rescue? How do you, y… you know, like, but somehow it's, it's that human spirit of going, "We've gotta get there. Now, how are we gonna do it? We'll work it out," you know? And I think that, you know, that's something that I think is a, is a really great, character, tone for…

39:46Jawad MirYeah

39:47Andrew Strahorn... For this movie of when you're in a position that you can't get out of, you've gotta keep moving regardless, you know? And so...

39:57Jawad MirAnd there is a, there is a saying, I mean, I've been hearing it since I was a child, and, you know, necessity is the mother of all inventions. And the other, the, there's an extended part to which I believe, which, you know, the human spirit is so strong…

40:13Andrew StrahornYeah

40:13Jawad Mir... That we don't realize how powerful we are mentally and emotionally until, and only until we are tested.

40:21Andrew StrahornYeah.

40:21Jawad MirBecause if we're not tested, then like, oh, you know, there we go. Like, it's, it's whatever. So I think, you know, even in our industry, like you, in any industry, like you've gotta be really tested because then it really measures your strength and your character and how far are you willing to go.

40:41Andrew StrahornI think you're 100% right. I think we all have a, we all have a story, we all have a journey of our time in this business and we all have humble beginnings. You know, hopefully when we're young and we can take the punches, you know, of the phone not ringing and the, just this pursuit and passion to be doing this vocation, yet you're, it's as if the, what the universe is saying, "No, you're not. Hang on there for a second. Take your turn." And so it's, it, you know, it forces you to adjust and to those moments and times and going, "Okay, there's a, there's a roadblock in front of me, but how do I move around that?" And I think, you know, I think that's, I think to your point, I think we, it's almost a rite of passage, really. I think everyone, every person you interview, I'm sure everyone has a story of…

41:43Jawad MirRight

41:44Andrew Strahorn... Of there being a no and maybe countless of noes, and just the pursuit of, "I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna make this happen." The very nature of filmmaking is almost, it's, it's a miracle that films get made…

42:00Jawad MirYeah

42:00Andrew Strahorn... When you really think about it. You know, you're, you're, you... We went over to Thailand, we shot there. You're in a foreign world. Lovely people, by the way. It was just the most gracious culture, that I've ever photographed in. Yet you're, you're there to make this movie and it's like you're, you're like, okay, it's taking maybe an extra 30 seconds to talk because we're talking through interpreters and people are, you know, we all have a different way. They had some very unique…... Ways of executing…

42:39Jawad MirSure

42:39Andrew Strahorn... That were just extraordinary because they basically adapted. And I think that, I walked away going, "Oh, that's genius the way they did that," you know? Because they had adapted over time what worked for their part of the world, of how they approached filming. And so I think that, yeah, I think it's almost a, you know, a badge of honor, but I think everyone has that, right? And I think in any w… walk of life, everyone has that, you know, that pursuit where you have to keep…

43:19Jawad MirRight

43:19Andrew Strahorn... Charging forward 'cause you're gonna get tested.

43:21Jawad MirYeah.

43:21Andrew StrahornYou know? And, you know, I started back in country New South Wales in Australia where, you know, I went to the movie theaters and as an eight-year-old and saw Empire Strikes Back and knew what I wanted to do. But the reality of that is finishing high school and 10 years later and going, "Okay, well how do I do this?" I mean, I'm literally in the country. Like, there's no, there's no filmmaking whatsoever. There's no... Other than, you know, a couple video stores back then, and, a movie theater that was a single screen that opened up three nights a week, and that was my early, seeds, if you will, of my path to the film business.

44:17Jawad MirYeah.

44:17Andrew StrahornBut it was,.. But those humble times and, you know, trying to, you know, fumble your way through of moving forward, you know, they definitely s… well, they definitely stayed with me even on a movie like this because regardless of what the challenges were logistically, whether it be safety or just physically putting cameras in areas that were just hard challenges, from a physics standpoint, it's like, okay, there's, there's definitely a solution here, you know? And I think a lot of that harks back to 30 years ago, you know?

44:59Jawad MirYeah.

45:00Andrew StrahornJust learning those principles.

45:02Jawad MirI agree. I agree. And I think it's a testament to the work that we all do, is that especially wanting to be somebody, I'm, I'm just gonna use the word, the example in the film industry because that's where both of you are, you and I are from, is that you don't know how to start and where to start.

45:19Jawad MirAnd you just gotta figure out, I mean, there's so many ways of starting, right? Like, the traditional way is, like, you know, you kinda get a job on a film set maybe as a craftsperson, maybe getting coffee with someone and you work your way up. Like, that's how ABC's CEO, sorry, Disney's CEO, what's his name? Bob Iger.

45:38Jawad MirHe used to be, like, a PA in the '70s, right? And, but at the same time, you just figure out different ways if that's not the way. I mean, that's been sort of my trajectory. I didn't go through the traditional way. I went through a completely different roundabout way, and somehow I was always connected to film.

45:57Jawad MirAnd it's just that pursuit of, you know, getting it, getting a film made, and I think that's the best thing that you can do.

46:05Andrew StrahornYeah. I think you're 100% right, mate, because it really, in its simplest form, it's, there's just this, you know, you're talking about a camera is an inanimate object. And a set or a location is an inanimate object, and then you have people, actors, and then from there it's whatever happens. So it's kind of like every step is, you're, you're muscling your way to the finish line. Some days easier than others, but, and particularly for a show like this, it was just such a physical…

46:44Jawad MirI bet

46:45Andrew Strahorn... Ordeal, with the environment that, by the time we finished photographing, on the mountain, we were like, we were like, it was Christmas. It was just like this was this, the extraordinary, you know, f… you know, feeling that overcame the entire crew because it's like, oh my God, we're not on the mountain, you know? Because it was just, the elements of, a lot of the wind, a lot of the sand, the, you know, then rain and whatnot. You're just out there. You're just, you're…

47:24Jawad MirYeah

47:25Andrew Strahorn... You're out there weeks and weeks and weeks on end, you know? And…

47:28Jawad MirIt's not a controlled environment, right? So.

47:31Andrew StrahornYeah. Yeah. It really is. And, you know, but that, I think, I always think that you kind of have to embrace as much as you can those elements and try to use the negatives as a positive. And s… and some days you're gonna win more than others, but ultimately I think that, you know, you're not gonna beat Mother Nature, so you might as well hang on for dear life. You know?

48:01Jawad Mir100%. 100%. With Fall 2 out now, is there anything else that you are working on that you're able to share, or you're just open for projects?

48:12Andrew StrahornRight now I'm just talking about a project, in Georgia and, something completely unrelated, and, to do with

48:26Jawad MirWow

48:27Andrew Strahorn... The '90s in Los Angeles and, so it's a period film and, something that, I've been lucky enough… That I've, I've enjoyed very varied, themes and, different genres, you know, from working with Peter Mike. The previous film that I shot that released last year was, a 1950s women's wrestling film…

48:57Jawad MirCool

48:57Andrew Strahorn... Called Queen of the Ring. So it was great to do something that was period biography and then go off and do something. To me it's like I always try to approach it like I've never shot before.

49:11Jawad MirThat's a good approach.

49:11Andrew StrahornSo always, even though you have experience, I always try to come at it with a completely fresh pair of eyes of going, "Okay, how do I do something hopefully that is truthful to this project, not something I can call back on that I've done before?" And I always try to, try to take that approach with any of the photography that I do is yes, you have experience and whatnot, but how do I look at this with a fresh pair of eyes going without any bias of going, "Okay, what is the set giving us? What is the costumes giving us? What is the design giving us? What is the elements giving us? And how can I now put that into a tone that hopefully reflects the script?" You know, so…

50:03Jawad MirThat's awesome

50:04Andrew Strahorn... I always try to approach it from.

50:06Jawad MirWell, that's, that's, that's really cool, man. And, it's funny you said period film and you said the '90s. It's like, oh man, we feel like... You know? I remember using the word period piece for '50s and '60s and, you know…

50:18Andrew StrahornYeah

50:18Jawad Mir... Maybe before that, like in the 1800s, but, you know, time flies. But th… that's awesome, man. Looking forward to it, and '90s was a very unique era, obviously, because a lot of us grew up in it, and…

50:30Andrew StrahornYeah. Yeah

50:31Jawad Mir... Looking forward to see what you're cooking with. That's awesome.

50:36Andrew StrahornYeah. Yeah. It's, it's, it is, it is... It kind of get a bit of a chuckle myself knowing that, you know, holy shit, like it was only 30 years ago, but… I don't know if I'm giving away my age or you're giving away your age, but it's, it's kinda like it really isn't that far gone, and it's so fresh in my mind of what that era was. And, you know, and I guess as a filmmaker, I'm so grateful and lucky. Obviously you don't, no one gets to determine when they're born, but I'm so grateful that all of my film knowledge as an idolistic kid was the '80s.

51:16Jawad MirYeah.

51:16Andrew StrahornSo you're seeing these images of Back to the Future and Aliens and Predator and Die Hard…

51:24Jawad MirYeah

51:24Andrew Strahorn... And you're going, "Wow, this is just like, this is amazing. Why wouldn't anyone wanna be in the film business?" You know? There's a bit of naivety with that, obviously, but, it was, you know... They… they're the types of movies I'm always trying to carry with me, going, "How do I photograph this in a way that I wanna go see this film?"

51:46Jawad MirYeah.

51:47Andrew StrahornWhat do I remember that were exciting, you know, iconic imagery that is like, yeah, I wanna go see that? And you know, half the time what we do is it's so haphazard, with regards to what sticks with the, pop culture and what works and what doesn't, you know? You kinda like, when you're shooting something, you never really... You know you might have something, but really ultimately the audience is the, is the…

52:22Jawad MirYeah

52:22Andrew Strahorn... Ultimate judge of that.

52:24Jawad MirI, and I know this from my experience and I've heard this so many people, and I'm sure you'll probably agree to it, like the things that you work on, whether it's a scene, a moment, an emotional arc that as a director, a writer, a DP or editor, you're like, "Oh, this is the moment that's gonna be remembered," right? And you work your like…

52:41Andrew StrahornOh

52:41Jawad Mir... Sweats into it. Never happens.

52:44Andrew StrahornYeah.

52:44Jawad MirAnd it's j… and it's just those oddly things that you don't even think about…

52:49Andrew StrahornYeah

52:49Jawad Mir... Somehow that they land with the audience, right? So it's just again…

52:52Andrew StrahornYeah

52:52Jawad Mir... The audi… audience is the final judge of what's…

52:55Andrew StrahornYeah

52:55Jawad Mir... What works.

52:56Andrew Strahorn100%. And it's, it's, it's, it's... And I think that's the beauty of it, what we do, right? Is that, you know, it's the magic of actually doing and living the craft, right? I guess it's great to see it finished with the bells and whistles and color and sound design and the editing and the effects and all of that. But really the older I've gotten, the more I've realized it's the actual, that moment of shooting is really, that's the epitome, you know, of the craft. And whatever hell happens thereafter, you have no, very limited control over at the very least.

53:39Jawad MirYeah.

53:39Andrew StrahornAnd so it's, to me, those are the moments that, you know, really, that I hold dear. Hopefully they resonate, but I hold dear as going, wow, you know, like I, you know, this, I'm, I'm lucky that this eight-year-old kid from country Australia…... Is in Thailand shooting this, you know, this film. It's just like, okay, what would he do? You know? First off, he'd love every moment of it. And, you know, so there's, there's, there's definitely some humbling experiences even though we know the business, the more you love it, the more you wanna do better. It can sometimes can become, you know, challenging.

54:23Jawad MirYes.

54:24Andrew StrahornAnd those are... And that was what was great about the Thai crew. They culturally, they're very, they're very…

54:34Jawad MirHardworking

54:34Andrew Strahorn... Self-motivated…

54:35Jawad MirAnd self-driven

54:36Andrew Strahorn... And hardworking. Holy hell. They are, they are... Wow. You could build a bridge with those, anyone over there, because they will not stop. They were incredible actually, the way that their work ethic, their work ethic is really admirable to say the least. You know?

54:56Jawad MirThat's amazing, man. That's really cool. Listen, man, it's been a pleasure, Andy. Lovely talking to you. Thank you for your work on the film. Entertaining, fun to watch, and most important, it has a little bit of a connection with the first one and an upcoming one, and there's an arc that engages people. So looking forward to the third one. Looking forward to your work. Next, whenever you are, whenever it's announced, if you can, I'll email you personally and you can drop me…

55:22Andrew StrahornYeah

55:22Jawad Mir... A message. That'd be really cool to know.

55:25Andrew StrahornNo worries, mate. Well, lovely talking to you, and thanks for taking the time.

55:28Jawad MirThank you so much. Have a good one. Take care.

55:30Andrew StrahornAll right, mate. Take care.

55:31Jawad MirBye. Bye.

55:32Andrew StrahornBye.